JEN GOTTLIEB: “Those are the stories that the media want to hear. Now, often, those are stories that are a little bit more messy. We like to say, ‘Your mess is your message.’ Or often, those are stories that maybe you don't necessarily really ideally want to tell, but you know that they’re the most powerful ones. Amy, I’ll give you an example of my lean-in story that I never knew was a lean in, and once I started leveraging it as a lean in, it really started to get me traction.”
INTRO: I’m Amy Porterfield, ex-corporate girl turned CEO of a multi-seven-figure business. But it wasn't all that long ago that I lacked the confidence, the budget, and the time to focus on growing my small-but-mighty business. Fast forward past many failed attempts and lessons learned, and you'll see the business I have today, one that changes lives and gives me more freedom than I ever thought possible, one that used to only exist as a daydream. I created the Online Marketing Made Easy podcast to give you simple, actionable, step-by-step strategies to help you do the same. If you're an ambitious entrepreneur, or one in the making, who's looking to create a business that makes an impact and a life you love, you're in the right place, friend. Let's get started.
AMY PORTERFIELD: I wanted to take a moment and share my newest podcast obsession. It's called the Female Startup Club podcast, and it's hosted by Doone Roisin, and this podcast is also in the HubSpot Network with me. Now, every episode is bite-sized and bingeable, with insights and learnings from the world's most successful female founders and entrepreneurs. I loved her interview with Glossier's community lead, Kim Johnson. They chatted about the five steps to build an impactful community, and you can bet I took notes and I am implementing these strategies. It was so good. So I know you're going to love this show. You can listen to the Female Startup Club wherever you get your podcasts.
So, back in 2019, I was featured in a Forbes article, and the article was all about me, which was really cool. The title was “How One Woman Broke Through the Glass Ceiling and Built a Multi-Million-Dollar Online-Course Empire.” And that article absolutely gave me momentum as I moved into the launch of Digital Course Academy. I've been in business for about thirteen years now, and I believe, even after all these years of being in business, that PR for your business is extremely important, whether you're just starting out; you've been at it for a while; or you're totally seasoned, and you’re thirteen or twenty years in. I believe PR is extremely important. In fact, whenever I have a media appearance, whether that be a feature article or maybe my podcast is featured or maybe I'm a guest on someone else's show, we see a spike in traffic, traffic to our website, to our podcast, and even sign ups of our newsletter.
Now, if you're anything like me, the introvert inside of you is saying, “Is PR really necessary as an entrepreneur?” Where are all my introverts? Raise your hand! The short answer is yes, but that doesn't mean you have to constantly step out of your comfort zone to make a PR appearance happen. There are definitely different ways to go about it.
My guest and a dear friend, Jenn Gottlieb, is my go-to when it comes to finding PR opportunities for my business. And today she's sharing all the things she advises me to do, with you. So Jen is the co-founder and chief mindset officer for the acclaimed PR company, Super Connector Media. She’s also a former VH1host and a Broadway actress. She's landed features in Forbes, Business Insider, Shape, Women's Health, CBS, Good Morning America, PBS, and Goop.
And today she's giving you a step-by-step approach for landing similar opportunities. I'm so excited for this episode. She'll tell you how to find the perfect opportunities that align with your goals, how to make an irresistible pitch they can't say no to, and she's giving you homework to get started today so you don't push this off but instead have the tools to land a PR opportunity by next week. Next week, my friend. But you got to do the work, and trust me, it's not that hard. That's the bonus. It's not that hard.
All right. Let's get into the show with the lovely Jen Gottlieb.
Well, hey, there, Jen. Welcome to the show.
JEN: Amy! So excited to be here.
AMY: How have you not been on the show yet? I mean, that feels crazy to me because we have been connecting all year long. And where did we first meet? I was trying to think about that. Where were we?
JEN: Amy, I think we—well, I know where we first met, but we didn't even realize we first met there. It was at a Jen Kim dinner.
JEN: And you reminded me of this. We were both there at the same time, but I don't think we really spoke that much.
AMY: We didn’t. Okay. I remember. Okay. Now it all is coming back to me. I remember leaving that dinner. It was, like, a networking dinner for women. It was so cool. I really loved it. But I remember leaving, thinking, “Everyone talks about this girl, Jen, over there. I did not get to meet her,” and I was bummed. And so I remember very vividly you being there and us not connecting. There were so many women there. It went by so fast.
JEN: I know. And I remember thinking—well, this is so crazy because I was like, “Amy Porterfield’s here. Oh, my gosh. I want to talk to her.” But we just didn’t get to. But I think everything—when you connect the dots looking backwards, everything always makes sense, right? And the way that we ended up actually connecting was exactly the way that it was supposed to happen. And I really believe, Amy, that it was very much through Clubhouse where we really developed our friendship.
AMY: Okay. I'm so glad you brought that up, because since I don't use Clubhouse much anymore, do you use it a lot?
JEN: No, not at all.
AMY: Okay. Which is so, so bizarre because we were all so into it.
AMY: But you are right. That is where you and I—that's where our love affair started because we so enjoyed being on each other's Clubhouses, and we were in so many of the same rooms, and I got to see your magic there. But also, it's funny you say that because I got to work with you and your team for ten months as my PR agency even before that.
AMY: That was before that. Isn’t it so funny to think of it that way?
AMY: So we worked for ten months, but I worked with a lot of people on your team.
AMY: Had an amazing year working with you. I will say this because we're going to talk about PR today, I felt a loss of momentum after not using your agency. We actually could feel it. PR is a little bit tricky to measure sometimes, and so we weren't always able to see all the metrics we do with, let's say, evergreen funnels and webinars and all of that. But we got to work with you for ten months. Then, I took a year off in 2021, and we felt it. We’re like, this might be due to our lack of our PR momentum that we had started. So I’m very happy to say we get to start working with you for a full thirteen months, starting in February of 2022, specifically around my book coming out, so it’s on. It’s happening.
JEN: It is so on. It’s so on. You have absolutely no idea how excited we are, the team, me personally. Actually, I was just at dinner with Angela, our chief publicity officer, last night, and you were a topic of conversation, just “Oh, great. This book’s going to be how huge it's going to be and how pumped we are.” So we're going to bring that momentum right back up, and we are going to times it by one hundred, Amy, just so you know.
AMY: It's going to be so much fun. I absolutely love your team, and I love the way you all do PR and approach PR.
So, let's talk about this. Let's talk about your expertise: leaning high-level PR opportunities and specifically for people in Myspace—like, you work with a lot of people in Myspace—so why do you think it's important to land PR for your business? And also, a lot of people are like, “This feels hard. This feels like a challenge,” so talk to me about that.
JEN: Yeah. So, okay. Let's start with, why is it important? I think that's a really great question, because a lot of people are like, “Yes, I need social media. I need Instagram. I need Facebook. I need Reels. I need all the things,” right? And PR is not necessarily always top of mind for people, but it's really crazy because the thing that all of the things I just listed—social media, Facebook, Instagram, all that stuff—what that really does for you in a big way is it gives you credibility and authority. And at the end of the day, credibility and authority and street cred, I like to call it, is your greatest asset when you are an entrepreneur, when you have a service, when you have a product, or when you just have a story that you would like to share, because think about how people’s brains work.
Let’s envision that we’re thinking about hiring someone. Let's just use an example of I'm going to hire a life coach, so I am on the hunt for a life coach. I like to have coaching in 2022, and I go to you, Amy, and I say, “Do you have any great life coaches that you could recommend?” and you recommend somebody awesome to me. Okay? And then I go and I ask a few other people, and they recommend a couple awesome people to me too. What am I going to do as a consumer? Well, the first thing I'm going to do with my recommendations, that are pretty high-level recommendations, is I'm going to go and I’m going to Google them. I’m going to look at their social media, but I'm going to go to Google, and I'm going to look at their websites.
Now, let's envision I got two referrals. They both cost the exact same amount of money. They both get the exact same results, and they're both from really great people that I really trust. I go onto the internet and I Google, and one of those life coaches has been featured on television, Good Morning America, the Today show. They've been in Women's Health magazine. They've been in Entrepreneur magazine, talking about mindset for entrepreneurs. They've been featured all over the place, and they have all these little credibility markers all over their website.
And then I go to the other life coach, that the other really amazing human in my life recommended to me, and they have no media presence. They have no trusted source telling me that they're awesome. Who am I going to hire? Who has the credibility in this situation? The person with all the media, or the person that doesn't?
And that is the question that you want to be asking yourself when you're thinking about your ideal customer or audience member, what they're thinking when they're actually thinking about, “Should I trust this person?” why should they trust you? Yes, you know you're awesome, but we can all get on the internet and say that we're awesome all day long, right?
JEN: I can get on social media and be like, “I'm awesome. Look at how great I am,” but not everyone can go and have Forbes say they're awesome or have the Today show think that you're so awesome that they bring you on. And that's why those people become the recognized experts, the go-to experts. They have the credibility, and that's what PR does for you. So that's why you need it. That's one of the many reasons.
AMY: Ah, so good. And I totally get that, 100 percent. I back that up with my own experience is deciding who I'm going to hire and who I'm going to work with.
So, one of the questions I followed up with is, is this a challenge to make happen? But before you answer that, I wanted to talk about, is this a challenge for people that are just starting out? because a lot of people that are listening, they're building their email list, they're starting to get their first course out into the world, and they don't have a huge following yet. So how can entrepreneurs use mainstream media to increase credibility and authority for their business, especially if they’re just starting out?
JEN: Yes. Okay. So, I love this question because it’s very, very exciting. If you are just starting out, you can still get media.
AMY: Oh, I'm so glad you said that.
JEN: Yes! In fact, it's the best time to do it. You want to start formulating the story. Ah, I've so much to say about this, because here's the thing. Many people think that the ROI from PR is the direct ROI, like somebody reading the article or watching this TV show and then calling me because of it. Yes, you can get ROI in that way. You can get followers, you can get customers, you can get all the things, but, really, 20 percent of the value of the hit is the actual hit; 80 percent is what you do with it afterwards. So since we're all listening to Amy Porterfield’s podcast here, we're all going to know that that is the truth, that you need to take those media hits that you get, and you need to amplify them to help tell the story and help build your brand and build your platform.
And I mean, I can go through all kinds of steps that your listeners right now can do today. You don't need to hire a publicist. And here I am. I have a PR agency, right? We represent people. But I'm going to tell you right now, if you're listening and you're like, “This feels hard. I don't have the money to invest in this right now,” you can do it yourself. And it all really stems down to your relationships—and you have more relationships than you even realize that you have, and I will dive into that a little bit deeper if you want to, Amy—and then also, getting really, really clear on your messaging and timely topics that you can talk on, and then, also, getting super, super, super crystal clear on where you want to be in the media; where your target audience is listening, watching, or reading; where are they hanging out? And once you have that whole formula in place, you can start to implement this for yourself immediately, even without a big audience.
AMY: Okay. So many questions to unpack in what you just said. So one of the things that you mentioned is amplifying. And when I started to work with your team, that was something that I was like, “Oh, there's this whole other level of PR that I knew nothing about.” So can you give people some examples of what it would look like to amplify a media placement that you got?
JEN: My favorite way to amplify any media placement is to tell a story around it. Now, the biggest mistake I see people make—and I'm sorry if anybody's listening to this and they did that. That's A-OK. That's how we learn, and we've all made this mistake, even me. I've done it plenty of times—is you get a great hit or you get a win, and your Instagram post or your Facebook post is, “I was just on this show this morning. Check it out.” Like, okay.
AMY: I’ve totally done that.
JEN: Right? Like, “Here it is. Check out my Forbes article.” And that's great one time. It's even great two times because people are going to celebrate you because they've never seen that. But think about it, Amy. If I'm in a different article every other day, it's going to get really old if I’m just like, “Check me out here. Check me out here. Check me out here.” No one’s going to be checking me out anymore, okay? Let’s be real.
But this is—my favorite way to get engagement and to share about my wins is to help tell my brand story and help actually relate to my ideal customer using that media hit. So here's what I mean. So I'm going to use an example of one of the ones that I've done before for me, so let's use the Forbes article that I just got. So I was just featured in Forbes, and this is really, actually, a great story for your listeners to understand how you can start to create pitches out of content you already have. So this is how this came to be.
I did an Instagram Live. My topic was how to connect in real life now that we're kind of out of practice because we've been coronavirus and hiding out for a really long time quarantining, and some of my tips to connecting in real life. I did this Instagram Live. I was like, “This is going to get so much engagement. This is the best topic ever.” Eh, it didn't do that great, Amy. It got some engagement. Some people commented, whatever. It wasn't a big deal. But I believed in it. I was like, “This is such a good topic. You know what? I'm going to use this exact same topic, and I'm going to formulate a pitch for Forbes because I think this is very timely, and I think that their audience needs to learn this now that we're going to events in real life again.” So I pitched it to a relationship that I had been building for years at Forbes, that I had never asked anything for before, ever. So that’s another key: having relationships and building relationships.
She takes it; she publishes it. It goes from being an Instagram Live to being a Forbes article, okay? And let's just talk about what we were talking about at the beginning of this podcast, what the mainstream media does for your credibility and your authority. Just because this exact same content had the title of Forbes on top of it, I suddenly got hundreds of shares, hundreds of comments, thousands of likes. In fact, I think I had over a hundred Instagram Story shares for my Forbes article. And I mean, let's even go even deeper. There were, like, four ex-boyfriends that came out of the woodwork, that messaged me. I'm so serious. They're like, “Oh, wow. You must be doing really well.” I'm like, “Dude, I talked about all that.” Like “Everybody, I've been talking about this content forever. Nobody cared.” And now that it's in Forbes, suddenly it gives me this credibility, right?
So, okay. So that ties back to the first part. But let's talk about how I amplified it. So when I amplified this specific Forbes article, the first thing that I did was I took an image of me, and I made it kind of look like a Forbes cover. So I've seen you do this before, Amy. I think you did this with our team. It was very amazing. You take the Forbes logo—anybody can do this—and you put it over an image of yourself so that people, when they're scrolling, they see, “Oh, wow, Amy's face and Forbes. I guess she was featured in Forbes.”
But what I wrote was actually a story about not how I was featured in Forbes, but a story about how I am actually really introverted and have a hard time connecting with people in real life sometimes. And people wouldn’t believe that. I had a conversation with my friend, and she said, “How do you have all this energy to go out and connect with people all the time? And how are you the super connector?” And I said this in my post. I was like, “Ironically, I'm actually really introverted, and it's really hard for me. But I have these tips and tools and tricks that I use personally to be able to be an introvert but still go and connect in real life. And I actually wrote about it in this article.”
So, I did two things there. Number one, I provided value to my audience. So I said the tips and tricks that I said in the article. Number two, I, then, used a story. My friend asked me, “How do I have all of this energy,” right? So you're already—people like to read stories rather than read about, like, celebrating me being in Forbes. And then number three, I actually also related to my ideal customer and their struggles, right? because all of my ideal customers, they're coming to me because they want to learn mindset tools and tips around connecting or reaching out to the media. Maybe they're not as confident, maybe they're introverted, so I was relating to them. And I was like, “Listen, I have this struggle, too. And here's some of the ways that I'm around it.” And then, boom, at the bottom, I say, “And P.S. Forbes thought this was so great that they published it, too.” So that's how I leveraged it, and that's why that article, I got a couple leads from it. I told you hundreds, thousands of shares, because of the style of which I amplified it, and also because of the fact that it was a Forbes article, of course.
AMY: Oh, I love this example. It's very, very actionable, and it brings it to life, so I'm glad you used that one. I know exactly what article you're talking about. You did a great job with the imagery so that it really was like, “Whoa, this is a big deal,” and then I remember that story vividly. So I appreciate you being so specific so my audience can actually apply this right away.
And I want to go back to something else you said earlier, and that was, I think you said something like you have more connections than you think you do.
AMY: Okay. Talk to me about that.
JEN: Yes. So one of the limiting beliefs that we often do to ourselves—and I am so guilty of this, Amy—is I just think that I don't have as much as I really do, because I don't have as much. I mean, I can go even deeper than relationships. Like, I don't have as many good ideas. I don't know as many people. My stories aren't that interesting, because the things that we already have that already exist in our lives, they're too close to us. We don't realize how amazing they are, and we don't necessarily know and realize and understand how deep they really go and how great we really are, because we're spending a lot of time comparing what we don't have to what other people do have, especially when we're looking at social media. So our viewpoint is totally skewed a lot of the times, and we don't even realize.
So, I like to sometimes take inventory on all of these things for myself. I do that in two different ways, and I'll give you these two different ways. We'll do the relationship one first, and then we'll do the mindset one second. So, we have a tool to be able to actually dive into your network and be able to use your network that you already have to get whatever it is that you want in twenty days or less. And it's called the top-twenty tool. Amy, this works 100 percent of the time if you do it. And you do not need to be a super connector. You do not need to feel like you have a million friends. You don't even need to feel like you have any connections. Every single person has a network; they just don't necessarily realize it. And this is also a tool that can help you garner the relationships that you would like to garner and build to be able to create win-wins and get whatever it is that you want, especially media. Do you want me to teach it to your listeners?
AMY: Please do. Is this the same one that my Entrepreneur Experience students got to engage in?
JEN: Oh, yes, it is.
AMY: Oh, they loved it. Okay, yes. This is exciting. Let's do it.
JEN: I teach this all the time because it's not just to be used for media. It can be used if you're raising capital, if you are trying to get clients, if you're trying to get on podcasts or get connected to influencers or trying to find a boyfriend or a girlfriend, anything, okay? So what you're going to do is you're going to make four columns on a piece of paper. So columns mean long ways, okay? And at the top of those four columns, you're going to write down your goal. So for this specific training today that we're doing with Amy, our goal’s going to be to get into the media. So everybody listening, if you want to get a media hit, let's make that your goal: to get one media hit, okay? And on the top of the first column, all the way over on the left, you're going to write People, and in that column, you’re going to do a list, a dump list. And when I say dump, it means literally don't think about the names you're writing down. Just write them down. Don't overthink it. Just write. A dump list of twenty people in your life network, anybody in your life you've ever connected with. This does not just mean your business network or your Instagram network or your Facebook network. It means family members, neighbors, people you went to high school with, college, anyone you've ever met in your life that has any kind of connection to somebody in the media, okay, because that's what we want.
And you may be thinking two things. Number one, “Oh, my god, Jen. I don't know twenty people.” Yes, you do. Open up the comments of the comments, the contacts in your phone. We all have hundreds of contacts on our phones. We don't even know who these people are, but they're there, right? Open up your Facebook friends, your Instagram friends. Think about, go get an old yearbook. I'm serious. You know twenty people, okay?
So the second thing your mind’s going to do is it's going to say, “Okay, Jen. I know this one person, but I could never reach out to them. That would make me severely uncomfortable.” Okay. That's fine. Don't worry about that. Just write their name down anyway. So we're just writing names down. That's it. Twenty names.
Next column over, on the top, you're going to write Influence, and you're going to rank each person that you've written down in your column one on a scale of one to ten on how influential they are in getting you what you want. So how influential are they in getting you a connection to somebody in the media or directly getting you into the media? So let's say your sister's boyfriend writes for Forbes. All right. Your sister would be in column one. And if it’s her boyfriend that’s the connection, I would say she’s pretty influential, right? I’d say she’s, like, a nine or a ten on the influential scale because it’s her boyfriend. They’re very close, right? But maybe if it’s your sister’s ex-boyfriend, and they haven’t spoken in years, I would say that your sister is maybe a two or a one on the influential scale, depending on how that relationship ended, right?
So, then, we move on over to the next column, and on the top of the next column, this is the third column over, you're going to write the word Help. Then, you're going to rank each person on a scale of one to ten on how likely they are to help you get that thing. So if you and your sister have an amazing relationship and you help her a lot and you guys are good, I would say, hopefully, she'd be a ten on how likely she is to help you. But let's say it's not your sister. Maybe it's someone you met on Instagram that you follow and you've had, like, two or three DMs with, but you know that they're very connected to somebody in the media, but you haven't really done a lot to help them. You don't have a great relationship. They can be on the list, but they're, like, a two on how likely they are to help you, right? Maybe they’re a ten influential, but a two on how likely to help, okay?
So, then, you're going to add up both of the scores, the influential score and the help score, and are going to get a grand final score in the last column. And then, you're going to sort those scores in descending order. It means the people with the highest scores are at the top of the list; people with the lowest scores are at the bottom of the list.
Now, here is what you’re going to do. This is the key for everyone. Top-of-the-list people, they have high scores. They're likely to help you. They're very influential. You're going to reach out to them, and you are just going to ask, because they're likely to help you. You've done a lot for them. You've got a great relationship. You can just call them up and be like, “Hey, I have this amazing pitch. I've got this great idea. I'd love to be in the media. I know you have this connection. Would you mind connecting me?” They're going to be excited to help you. But the people at the bottom of the list, instead of reaching out and asking them for help—you can't do that yet, because they've got low scores in how likely they're going to help you. Maybe you have to build that relationship up—so instead of asking them for help, you're going to do one thing to provide value to them, and you're going to keep providing value to them and keep providing value to them until you've created a relationship where you both are at this point where you're, like, win-win relationshipping and you help them, and then they're like, “Can I please help you?” And then, you know, that's how the law of reciprocity works. And then not only do you have an amazing new friend and a relationship for life, but now you're both symbiotically helping each other. So people at the top of the list, you’re going to ask them. People at the bottom of the list, you're going to slowly give and give and give and give and provide value until it becomes a powerful relationship where you are both giving and taking together. And then I promise you, Amy, and everybody that’s listening, if you work this list, you will get in the media, or whatever it is that you want.
AMY: Ah, okay. So, some people that are listening right now are on the treadmill. They're driving to work. They're on a subway. Do not worry. We're going to take exactly what Jen said and put it in the show notes step by step so you can go back to the show notes. Just go to amyporterfield.com, look for Jen's episode, and we’ll write it out for you because I want every one of you to do this exercise in the next seventy-two hours. So if you're listening now, whenever you're listening, seventy-two hours, do this exercise. Jen is telling you this works, and I have seen it work over and over again with me and my students. You’ve got to go give this a shot. All right. Fantastic.
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Okay. So, one of the things that I know comes up with a lot of my students when it comes to PR is that they are not sure what type of media they should be going after. So what are some ways to figure out what type of media you should be getting for your specific goals? I mean, there are blog features, and you can get on podcasts and be featured on news outlets. You've got TV. You've got radio. You've got podcasts. How do you know which one is best for you in terms of what you're aiming to achieve?
JEN: This is such a great question, Amy. It’s so good. And I've got two great answers for you. One of them, people are going to be like, “What? Are you serious?” but it's the best. And the other one's kind of obvious. So the first answer is, if you don't know where you should be showing up, ask your dream clients, your ideal clients, or someone that you would like to be your dream client—maybe you don't have any clients yet. Figure out who your dream avatar is, which, Amy, I'm sure you help people figure that out—go find a few of them and ask them, “What podcasts are you listening to? Do you read the news? What kind of different blogs are you looking at? Are you watching TV? Are you watching YouTube channels? Where are you getting your content and your information?” Ask them.
And if you've got clients that you absolutely love working with them, ask them. Be like, “Hey, do you listen to podcasts? What's your favorite? Do you read any blogs, or do you have a news app on your phone? Which news stations are you watching? Do you watch your local television station? Do you watch the Today show?” Find out just by asking.
You can even do an Instagram poll, or even in your Stories, ask, “Hey, what do you watch, read, and listen to the most? Where do you get your content? Where do you get your information?” And use that to be able to make your target hit list.
Now, the second thing I'm going to tell you all to do is actually probably the most powerful one. It’s always been for me, because it’s actually done a lot more for me than just showing where I should be in the media. And that is to use FOMO as a tool. And I don't mean old-school FOMO, like, “Oh, my god. My friends are at a party, and I'm totally FOMOing.” Like, yes, that happens. And that feeling, yeah, that sucks. But FOMO, meaning fear of missed opportunity. And that's that feeling that you get when you either turn on your TV or you open up your iPad or your computer or your social media, and you see someone who maybe is a “competitor” or they do the same thing as you, or it's a mentor of yours that's doing what you want to do, and you get this feeling in your gut. And it's a really strong feeling. You guys all know it. Amy, I know you know it, because I know it so well. And it's like, “Oh, my god. That should be me.”
JEN: “Oh, I should be doing that.” Now, that feeling can either take us down the rabbit hole of, “Oh, man. I'm not good enough, so I shouldn't even try,” so it could either really destroy us, or we could use it as our greatest tool to figure out where we should be in the media, what we can be talking about, and what people want to write about and want to feature, because that person is clearly doing something right. So what I do is I'll just make a list of the people I'm FOMOing over, and I'll go into Google, and I'll go into Google News, and I will type their name into Google News. And I will see, what blogs are they featured in, what podcasts have they been on, what reporters and journalists are writing about them, because if those reporters and journalists like to write about them, that means they would also like to write about me because they like to write about that topic. What are those people talking about in the news? because that means that those topics, that are probably similar to what I do or what you do, is news worthy. Do your research by following people who have already painted the yellow-brick road for you. It's A-OK because guess what? You're not going to be anything like them because there's only one you. There's only one Amy Porterfield. There might be other people that teach people how to create courses, but there is only one person that does it the way Amy does.
So there can be two different articles saying the same thing, one from Amy's point of view and one from somebody else who does the same thing. And you can just use what those people that you're FOMOing over did to help you see where you should be showing up. It's absolutely so powerful, and I highly recommend that you guys all research those people and then make a hit list. I like to do five to start, my media hit list, my top five. And just write them out, whether they’re TV shows, podcasts, different blogs or different YouTube shows, or even different publications that you know your ideal audience is watching, reading, listening to, because the people that do something similar to you or who are mentors or people you're FOMOing over have already hit those, so clearly it's working. Does that help? Does that make sense?
AMY: Yes, very actionable. Two things you guys can do right away. And while you were talking, it made me think about the story that you shared with Forbes and the fact that you did an IG Story and then you thought, “You know what? It didn't get as much traction as I thought, but I'm going to pitch this.” So how do you create stories that will grab the attention of the media?
JEN: Mm-hmm. Great question. Okay. So, I like to use what I call lean-in stories. Now, here's what a lean-in story is.
AMY: Oh, I love this. I've heard this before, and this is one of my favorites. So if you're multitasking, come back because this is good.
JEN: Come back because you're going to hear about the meerkat.
JEN: So long as you're having a conversation with somebody, it can now—it could be on Zoom or at a party or in real life. And suddenly you notice that that person is just not paying attention to you anymore. Maybe they're looking over your shoulder for somebody else more cool or more important to talk to. And I call that the meerkat. Like, they're stretching over your shoulder, and you can totally tell. Or if you're Zooming with them, and they start Googling or checking their text or checking their email. So whatever you're talking about in that moment, that's not a lean-in story. Remember that, because sometimes the stories that we tell, like I said this at the beginning of the episode, the stories that we tell, the people that we know, the things that we do, we’re too close to them, so we don't know how awesome they are or how not awesome they are because we live them and our viewpoint is skewed, so we have to find out from other people. So we all know those stories that we tell, and when we tell them, all of a sudden someone stops meerkatting, they look at you, and they pay attention, and they're like, “What? Really? Oh, my gosh. Tell me more.” And they lean in, and they light up, and their physicality changes. That’s a lean-in story. Those are the stories that the media want to hear. Now, often, those are stories that are a little bit more messy. We like to say, “Your mess is your message.” Or often, those are stories that maybe you don't necessarily really ideally want to tell, but you know that they’re the most powerful ones. Amy, I’ll give you an example of my lean-in story that I never knew was a lean in, and once I started leveraging it as a lean in, it really started to get me traction.
So, I used to be on VH1 for, like, four years. I was a co-host of a heavy metal talk show, okay?
AMY: I love that.
JEN: Right. So, you're laughing. You're leaning in, I can tell. We’re not even looking at each other.
AMY: Yes. I’m leaning in.
JEN: You’re leaning in, right? I did this the other day at a party. I was at a party, and I was talking to this girl, and she wanted nothing to do with me. She was not interested. And I was very—it was fine. I was like, “You are cool. This is a lame conversation.” But the second that I told her that, all of a sudden, she wanted to be my BFF. I'm telling you she was leaning in. She was paying attention. She's like, “That's so cool.”
So I never used to want to talk about the fact that I was on VH1 when I first started my business because it had nothing to do with it. And I'm sure there's a lot of people listening right now that has done other things in their past, they've transitioned into being a course creator or an online marketer, and they're like, “I don't want to talk about what I used to do because it has nothing to do with what I do now.” I beg to differ because the most powerful story for me has always been how this ex-VH1 host turned entrepreneur, mindset coach, whatever it is. I’ve done so many TV shows and articles and podcasts all about my past, being on Broadway and my past being on television, because that's always been the lean-in story. That's where people pay attention. People love to hear how someone made a really powerful transition, or they went from point A to point B, or they lost it all and then gained it all.
What is that lean-in story for you? And that story usually has to do with your hero's journey or something maybe that you wouldn't think is typical that would go with what you do now, but that's what makes it cool. That's what makes you different. That's what makes it interesting.
So my ask for everybody listening right now is to just have more conversations with people about stories that maybe you don't necessarily tell, and find out when they lean in and when they giggle and when they want to know more, and then start playing with that messaging and tying that into what you do now. And then you can even go a step further, and when you pitch the media, think about a timely topic that you can tie it to.
So we’ll go a step further with actual media logistics here. When it comes to pitching the media, you usually want to speak to the media's audience, right? The producer, the journalist, they don't necessarily care about you or your story, but they care about their audience. And their audience usually cares about what's happening right now. So what's in it for them?
So if you find out that your lean-in story—a lean-in story for me was that I'm an introvert, right? Like, I'm actually, and people would never believe that. They’re like, “Wait. What? Really? Tell me more.” So that’s a lean-in story for me—so I’m like, “Hm, okay. How can I tie that into a timely topic?” So I thought, “A timely topic is that we are all now having to go back out into the world and socialize. So what are some tips that I use that people can now use to go out and socialize better, and entrepreneurs specifically?” So I turned it into a timely pitch for Forbes. I used my lean-in story, which is that I'm actually an introvert and people don't really realize that. And then I was like, “Hm, Forbes, here's how your audience, even if they are introverted, can also now start getting out into real life and connecting more powerfully.” So I tied it into a timely news hook. So, lean-in story plus timely news hook equals exactly what you should be talking about in the media.
AMY: Okay. That actually is a perfect segue because my next question was going to be, do you have any tips for writing a pitch that stands out above the rest? And I feel like, number one, right there, you just gave us some valuable insight in terms of pitching media. But do you have any other tips for writing a pitch? because a lot of people listening right now will not be in a position yet to hire a PR agency. They're going to be doing it on their own, so they would love some tips for pitching.
JEN: Yep. So I've got your five elements.
AMY: Oh, yeah, you do.
JEN: Five points of a winning pitch. So, everyone that’s listening right now, do not worry. You do not need to hire a publicist. You can literally just go pitch yourself right now with these five elements. So, Amy, you’re totally right.
Number one is a timely news hook relevant to the outlet. So you want to make sure that you’re—that timely news hook could be a holiday. Guys, there is a national holiday for freakin’ everything now, isn't there, Amy?
JEN: Right. Donut Day. I'm sure there's National Course-Creation Day. There's got to be. Just go to nationaldaycalendar.com. Google “national holidays,” and you'll find them. And you can tie in what you do to a national holiday. You can tie in what you do to maybe something that's happening in the news currently. I know that when TikTok was going to be banned, we had a couple of social-media experts that we represented, and they became the talking heads for that subject because that was a timely topic, right? So think about what your news hook is for what you do. There's always something you can tie it to if you get really creative.
And then the second one, the second element, I guess, of a winning pitch is to pitch the topic first and yourself second. This is so important because the biggest mistake, number one mistake, I see people make when they pitch is they open up their pitch with, “Hi, Amy. I'm Jen Gottlieb, and I am a PR expert from New York City.” Like, no. I'm so sorry, but that producer or that journalist or that editor or whoever it is, that podcast host, they don't care about you yet. They will. They don't yet. They care about their audience. So the thing that you want to open up the pitch with is value to their audience. So the topic of your pitch, so let's open it up with, maybe it's a statistic. Like, did you know that 60 percent,”—let's use a Valentine's Day pitch as an example. I think I’ve used this with you guys before—let’s say, “Sixty percent of couples are getting divorced now. I don’t know what the stats are, but, you know, let’s say you’re a relationship coach, and you’re pitching Valentine’s Day. “Sixty percent of couples are getting divorced, and this Valentine’s Day is no different. People are having a harder time connecting during COVID than ever before.” So that's your topic. And then the second paragraph you say, “Hi. I'm so-and-so. I'm a relationship coach from New York City, and I would love to come onto your show and give your viewers five tips that they can implement on Valentine's Day to reconnect with the love of their life.”
So you understand the topic is first with statistic, and that's going to be my next point. And then the next paragraph, you introduce yourself and say why you are worthy of giving their audience this information. Cool?
So we've got, number one, timely news hook relevant to the outlet. Number two, pitch the topic first and yourself second. And number three is, I'm just going to bring in part of what I just said for number two, is you want to make sure you back up your claims with a few statistics. So, you don't have to know the statistics by heart. Good news. You can go into Google, you guys. Go into Google, find some statistics on your topic, find some studies that were done, and just add them in there to back up your claims so that the producer knows that you're legit and that what you're talking about is true. And then you want to always hyperlink those studies. So that's number three.
Then, number four, you want to add talking points. Very, very, very important, especially for TV. So television producers, they're often, they're working really fast. They have to develop these TV segments sometimes within an hour or so if there’s breaking news. So they don’t have time to create a whole segment, so you want to create the segment for them.
What talking points are are four to six bullet points underneath your pitch of different things that you could talk about. So let's say you said, “Oh, I'm going to come and give your viewers five great tools they can use this Valentine's Day to reconnect with each other.” So you could make your talking points those five tools. “Number one, go on a picnic date outside.” I don't know. I'm not a relationship coach, right? But you can bullet out those five talking points, okay?
And then your fifth and final most important element of a winning pitch—I’m saying that this is the most important one because I truly believe that it is for absolutely everything that you create in your life—is you want to make sure that you stand for what you believe in, and you stand for something. So you don't want to be wishy-washy when you're pitching. You don't want to say things like, “Some people believe that this is true, but some people don't.” And you don't want to say things like, “Maybe,” or “A fraction of people.” If you believe that something is very bad, I want you to say that it's very bad. If you believe that something is wonderful, I want you to say that it's wonderful. They want to feature people that have an opinion, that stand for what they believe in, because if you stand for all things, you stand for nothing. Stand for what you believe in, and that's what's going to make you stand out from the crowd, and they're going to always bring you back on to talk about that topic if they know that you are truly a believer in what you do and you are truly focused on your side of the coin, and that’s just how the media works. So stand for something.
Do you want me to review them, Amy?
AMY: One more time, go through the list.
JEN: Okay. Number one, timely news hook relevant to the outlet. Number two, you want to make sure that you include stats, facts, and figures and studies. Number three—oh, two and three, you want to pitch the topic first and yourself second. You can swap those, or you can just keep them as two and three. And then number four, you want to add talking points. Make sure you have those bulleted out. And number five, stand for something.
AMY: Fantastic. Okay. Some people are listening, and they're like, “Dang, this girl is on fire.” You always have very actionable tips, strategies, insights that people can apply right away. But here's the great news. I wanted this episode to come out at a very specific time because Jen and her partner, Chris, are doing something called Be On TV Bootcamp, and I think this could be a great program for so many of you who are listening. So, Jen, before I let you go, and actually, we've got one more thing after this, but before I let you go, tell everybody about the Be On TV Bootcamp program.
JEN: Yes. So our Be On TV Bootcamp’s coming up. We have done this Be On TV Bootcamp, this is going to be our tenth time. And we help—
AMY: I didn't know that.
JEN: Yeah! —thousands of people learn how to get on TV in five days. It is so much fun. And let me just tell you, if you're sitting there and you're like, “Jen, I've never even done a Facebook Live before,” you don’t have to be an influencer. You don’t have to be good on camera. You don't have to be an extrovert. We work on mindset, confidence, messaging, clarity, pitching. We teach you everything that you need to know to be able to get on TV in five days, okay? And we've done it enough times that we know that it works. We have so many testimonials. So if you want to sign up and join us, we have a very special link for all of Amy's listeners. Amy, you want to read out what your link is?
AMY: Yes. So it's amyporterfield.com/beontv. Easy as that. Amyporterfield.com/beontv. And I'm telling you, the success stories that have come out of this blow my mind. I'm always paying attention to how these programs are working, and what are people saying about it. You guys have some of the best testimonials out there that I've ever seen, and so this actually works. And the fact that it's just five days is really cool. Like, five days you could be on TV. So, you guys, go sign up. It is fantastic. I highly, highly recommend it.
Okay. So, before I let you go, are you open to some rapid-fire questions?
JEN: Oh, I'm so down. So, let's go.
AMY: Okay. This is kind of a new thing we're doing on the show. I haven't done it a lot yet, so I'm excited to do it with you. Five questions, rapid fire, here we go. Ready?
AMY: Number one, who is someone that's inspiring you at the moment, and why?
JEN: Mm. You, right now.
AMY: Ah, come on.
JEN: You, right now, because of the way that you've been showing up. And we’ve talked about this, Amy. I'm just going to go into this for two point five seconds. I know it’s rapid fire, but I know that we've talked about this. You, the way that you've been showing up on social media and everywhere has just been so motivating to me because you're just out there being you. And I just am mesmerized by how much you have grown in the way that you show up, and I can't wait for this book to come out.
AMY: Well, I appreciate you saying so. What's so true about Jen, she actually texted me that exact thing that she just said. She texted that to me a few weeks ago, so it means the world to me, so thank you.
Okay. Number two, what is the best advice you've ever received?
JEN: When you love yourself as much as you care what other people think about you, you will change your life.
AMY: Okay. I first heard that from you, and it was profound. So say it one more time.
JEN: When you love yourself as much as you care what other people think, you will change your life.
AMY: And I firmly believe that.
Okay. Number three, what is the one daily habit that you swear by in your routine? And I just got to say, everybody, Jen will tell you where to follow her on social, but she shares a lot of her routines. And there's some ice baths, there’s some red-light therapy. There's a lot going on here that I am glued to. But out of all the daily habits, what is that one that you swear by?
JEN: The one that I swear by is the most simple one: walking. Taking walks.
JEN: Yes. I mean, I work out every day. I do ice baths. I do red light. I do NAD. I do all the things. I love all the biohacky stuff. And it all works. But there is nothing better for your mind and your soul than a really nice, long walk. And often I will do my manifesting when I walk, and I'll pray and listen to music. And there is nothing better than that, and I will never miss my walk. In fact, it's getting cold in New York, so Chris, for Hannukah, bought me this little treadmill, that I have under my desk, where I can walk while I take calls, and I don't have to go out in the cold.
AMY: Okay. I was going to ask you about that because I, too, have a treadmill at the house, because in Tennessee, it gets very cold in the winter. And I was going to ask if you're out there, in, like, twenty-degree weather, walking.
AMY: Okay. Gotcha. So, you have an alternative, which I was, like, damn, I am not that strong.
AMY: But I agree. I used to walk so much to clear my mind and also keep my anxiety and depression in check. Walking is that number one thing that does it for me. Okay. So, same page.
Number four, what is your favorite media outlet at the moment, and why?
JEN: Ooh. Okay. My favorite media outlet at the moment—and it's not just because I have a bootcamp coming up all about it, but it kind of maybe always will be—is television. And the reason is not that someone's going to flip on the TV and watch you and want to hire you. The reason is that whenever I'm on TV, that image of me being on TV is the coolest to everybody. It’s cooler than anything. It’s even cooler than Forbes. People go crazy, and it makes people proud that they work with you, that they know you. It’s the street cred of all street cred, still to this day, being on TV.
AMY: I agree, 100 percent.
Okay. Number five, where do you think PR is heading next?
AMY: What do you see?
JEN: I think that PR is actually coming back with a giant vengeance. I think that for a moment people were like, “Oh, it's all about social media and internet marketing and everything.” And I think that with the algorithms and everything like that, we need to build up our credibility and our trust factor even more, and having that mainstream media is what's going to decide who's the real deal and who's not.
JEN: Yeah. I think that it's the thing that people aren't doing enough of, and they're going to start realizing it, and it's going to be big time.
AMY: For all of my course creators and my future course creators, I'm telling you right now, if you dedicate a chunk of time to pitching yourself to different media outlets, it will help you grow your email list and help you sell more courses down the road. I really have seen how powerful this is. And it's like list building, where you need to be patient. It happens over time. But the more opportunities you get yourself out in, the better, and so I want you to start applying what you've learned right away. And the best way to do it, like, right away, if you loved what you've learned from Jen here, get into her bootcamp. So it's Be On TV Bootcamp, and it's amyporterfield.com/beontv for all the details. Do not miss it.
Jen, I adore you. I’m one of your biggest fans. Every time I'm around you, I feel better about myself, and I love our friendship. Thank you so much for being here.
JEN: Oh, I love you more. This was the highlight of my day, and I can’t wait to listen to it later. This was awesome. Thanks, Amy.
AMY: Bye, friend.
Before we wrap up, I wanted to share this with you. I remember when I was first starting out, taking the time to pitch myself to media outlets and look for feature opportunities, and it was such an important part of growing my business. And although I say when I was first starting out, the truth is we are still using PR in our business. I mean, heck, you heard me say that all of 2022 and into 2023, as my book is released, we will be working with Jen's team. That's how important I think this is. But you heard Jen say it. You don't need to hire a publicist in order to get featured in some of the biggest media outlets. You, my friend, can do this alone.
So I want to highly encourage you to work through the exercise that Jen shared with you today. As I mentioned, I'm going to put it in the show notes. I want you to go to the show notes, grab a piece of paper, make the list of the names, and then start reaching out according to the scores that you give it. And remember, how do you feel when someone asks you to connect them with someone you know? You feel happy to make the connection, right? So keep that in mind if you get butterflies in your stomach before asking. So that's your homework. Go do the exercise that Jen outlined in this episode. Do it in the next seventy-two hours. That is my challenge for you.
All right. I hope you loved today’s episode. I know I absolutely did. And if you’d be so kind, please share this with a friend or two. Remember, it’s all about referrals and connections.
All right, my friend. I’ll see you next week for my Shorty episode on Tuesday, same time, same place. Bye for now.