Listen To My Latest Podcast Episode:

#486: 1 Digital Course, 1 Evergreen Funnel, 6-Figures: How This Mom Of 2 Made It Happen with Jessica Berk

Listen To My Latest Podcast Episode:#486: 1 Digital Course, 1 Evergreen Funnel, 6-Figures: How This Mom Of 2 Made It Happen with Jessica Berk

ANNIE CHANG: “With evergreen, what you get is time, time for us to keep serving our community, the people inside our program. And with live launches, though, of course, that gives us a huge injection of sales and really allows us to attract the people who need that momentum and energy, you know, doing this with a community, a group of people. And in terms of conversions, so it's around 10 to 11 from live webinars versus 5 percent from evergreen webinars.” 

INTRO: I’m Amy Porterfield, ex-corporate girl turned CEO of a multi-seven-figure business. But it wasn't all that long ago that I lacked the confidence, the budget, and the time to focus on growing my small-but-mighty business. Fast forward past many failed attempts and lessons learned, and you'll see the business I have today, one that changes lives and gives me more freedom than I ever thought possible, one that used to only exist as a daydream. I created the Online Marketing Made Easy podcast to give you simple, actionable, step-by-step strategies to help you do the same. If you're an ambitious entrepreneur, or one in the making, who's looking to create a business that makes an impact and a life you love, you're in the right place, friend. Let's get started. 

AMY: So, I have a little homework for you. I want you to head to your favorite podcast-listening platform; search for the podcast Success Story, hosted by Scott D. Clary; and start listening. Success Story is a new podcast obsession for me; and it features Q&A sessions with successful business leaders; keynote presentations; and conversations on sales, marketing, business, and entrepreneurship. Scott recently spoke with a guest about the importance of socially conscious entrepreneurship, and I love that conversation. This is such an important topic right now, so be sure to check out that specific episode, for sure. You can listen to Success Story wherever you get your podcasts. 

Welcome to another episode of the Online Marketing Made Easy podcast. I'm excited for today's episode because I get to chat with one of my students, and it's actually been a while since I had a student on the show, so it's high time that we do this. But I know my audience well, and I know you love nothing more than listening to real-life examples of how my students have built a successful digital-course business, so that's exactly what we're getting to today.  

And what's so cool about my student, Annie Chang, is that she and her sister have built their online business, Olea & Fig, in just a few years. They wrapped up 2021 with over four hundred thousand dollars in revenue, and they've structured their business in a way that works for them and not the other way around.  

Today we're talking about the progression of their business and how they went from selling a PDF product to creating a digital course, offering a backend membership, and then putting their course and their challenges leading up to their courses on evergreen. So they still do live launches, and they do evergreen, and it's a beautiful business model.  

They have such a cool story, and you know that we're getting into what strategies have worked for them. And something that I love about all of this is that Annie was recently able to take off a lot of months—I'm not even going to tell you. You’ve got to listen—a lot of months when she had her brand-new baby boy. So that's pretty cool, too. We'll get into it. She was able to take off all this time because they've set up their business in a way to support their freedom. 

You're going to love this episode, and I personally can't wait to talk to Annie, so let's get to it. 

Well, hey, there, Annie. Welcome to the show. 

ANNIE: Hi, Amy. Thanks for having me. 

AMY: Oh, I’m so glad you’re here. I've been excited about you joining me. And as always, I love getting to sit down and chat with my students. It's, like, what I live for, and to spotlight you, and for you to share your journey is going to be so valuable to our listeners. So first of all, tell us what you and your sister teach. 

ANNIE: We help solo entrepreneurs become the go-to in their markets, by teaching them how to build and grow a customer-attracting online brand. 

AMY: A customer-attracting online brand. Okay. So, I want to talk about the progression of your business today because I want to really paint a picture of what's possible for my other students and how they can think outside of the box, like you and your sister have absolutely done. So with that, can you walk us through where your business started and, really, what the structure of it looks like today? 

ANNIE: Yes, of course. So, we were both in the corporate world, and I actually originally studied chemical engineering in the tech industry. And Terrie, my sister, she was an industrial designer and worked in marketing. So we both got so tired of our nine-to-five job after several years in and that we decided to take a complete opposite route and start our business in designing events and experience and brand campaigns.  

And because of work, we got connected with so many small businesses and freelancers, and we spotted their needs to brand and market their business. So it was the perfect opportunity to bring them what we were great at and our know-hows back in the corporate world in growing and marketing businesses. 

So we started testing for this idea in 2018 and helped women-owned businesses and brands market their businesses, and, basically, pivoted fully in 2018 to helping them grow and market their solopreneur brands. 

AMY: Got it. And so you started in 2018, and in 2021, what did your revenue look like? 

ANNIE: So, we made close to 320K, all from our online offers, and 276K from courses of membership. 

AMY: Wow! That is incredible! Congratulations.  

And so, I want to talk to you about some strategies that work, but before we get there, talk to me about what it is that you sell, meaning, like, if I told people how I make money, I'd say, “I have two evergreen courses, one live course that I launch, and a membership.” That's, like, the bulk of the revenue that we have coming in. What does your makeup of your business look like? 

ANNIE: So, we have two programs—and we can talk about this a little more—but we, basically, have two programs marketed to different audience, two different audience; one with personal support and membership, and the other one doesn’t. 

AMY: Got it. Okay. So, that's what you've got. To make the kind of money you made, you've got two courses.  

ANNIE: Yes. 

AMY: Incredible.  

Okay. So, let's get into some strategies that have worked well for you. So, can you break down the way you launch your core program? And like you said, you have two unique offers of the same program. I would love to talk about that because there's a lot of people listening right now that they have two different avatars, and they want to address both of them, and it sounds like that's the situation here, or maybe not. So what does it look like to have two unique offers of the same program? 

ANNIE: Basically, one audience, they're more used to tactic focused. They’re more used to this “a la carte” way of purchasing; whereas, the other one, they want it all, right? They want the support, the personal support, the community. And also, because they are two audiences that actually speak different languages and different cultures, so that's how they're used to consume these materials and resources from us.  

So what happens is we, basically, break up the bulk of our know-hows in two ways, two different ways. The program is the same, but we break them up differently. One with smaller, bite-size offers; and one, basically, you know, you get this whole thing, all in one, including support and membership. 

AMY: Got it. Okay. So you're really saying, if you're this type of person who enjoys, let's say, more support, more hands on, this is the offer for you. But then you've got it where you break it down into bite-size pieces? 

ANNIE: Yes. So, more tactic focused. So say that, you know, with branding and marketing, there are obviously different areas to cover. With the bite-size pieces, what I'm talking about is based on tactics. So maybe this is Instagram marketing, maybe this is Facebook marketing, and things like that. 

AMY: Got it. Okay.  

And how do you launch your programs? 

ANNIE: Yeah. So we run our programs on an ongoing basis. We do two live webinars a year. And this is, of course, using some of the templates that you gave us.  

AMY: Love it. 

ANNIE: And also, we turn that into evergreen webinars. So, basically, the templates that we learn from DCA, we turn that into evergreen webinar by recording it and automating things. So that is ongoing. And then we also run evergreen challenges that goes year round. 

AMY: Oh, fantastic. Okay. I love your business model. Very similar to mine in the sense that you do live launches twice a year, so same product but with upgrades. And then you offer the membership and the personal support, and then you have ongoing launching at any time, which is evergreen. And you do what I do as well, as you said, you do certain challenges and different special promos into the evergreen. And I think that's important. I don't think it's enough to just run evergreen in the background and think that it's one and done and you can move on. But doing some special things to your email list or social to also get some traffic into that evergreen maybe once a quarter is such a great idea. So we have similar businesses in terms of how we launch.  

And one of the questions I have for you is, do you see a big difference in the conversion rates for these two different programs? So maybe it'd be helpful if you share the cost of each program and then the conversion rates you're seeing? 

ANNIE: Yeah, of course. So costs are about 15 to 20 percent of our revenue for live launches versus 25 to 30 percent of revenue for evergreen. So as you can see, there is a significant difference here. But of course, with evergreen, what you get is time, time for us to keep serving our community, the people inside our program. And with live launches, though, of course, that gives us a huge injection of sales and really allows us to attract the people who need that momentum and energy, you know, doing this with a community, a group of people. And in terms of conversions, so it's around 10 to 11 from live webinars versus 5 percent from evergreen webinars. 

AMY: Amazing numbers. Incredible. You should be so proud of yourselves. That is so solid. And I think some listeners are going to be surprised to hear what you just said, but it makes total sense, that your evergreen launches and campaigns are more expensive than your live launches. I heard that right, right? 

ANNIE: Yes, yes. Correct. 

AMY: Okay. And that for us is true because of running ads every single day in evergreen. Why is that true for you? 

ANNIE: For evergreen, yes, you’re right. The cost actually comes from running the ads on an ongoing basis. However, with live launches, even though we also do run ads, I think it's the momentum excitement, right? People want this now. Plus, with live launches, we added more bonuses, more incentives for people to join us right now at this time. And I think that people really appreciate that. “Okay. I'm going to dedicate my next one month or three months to this thing that I'm going to do for myself,” and I think that, for a lot of people, is actually very attractive because of accountability. 

AMY: Yes. I’m so glad you said that because you're right. It's not just that evergreen is more expensive because we're running more paid ads, but the conversion is lower for evergreen than in a live launch. Absolutely the same for us. And there's a lot of talk online right now about people feeling launch fatigue. And I want to ask you about how you manage your emotions and your energy and your resources during a live launch, to stay in the game and stay effective.  

But before I get there, I want to point out that there's a lot of talk in the industry about live launching. It's so stressful. It's so overwhelming. You should just move to evergreen. And you and I are perfect examples of the fact that you can have both in your business, and there's a place for both. Because you're right, when you live launch, your conversions tend to be higher than evergreen, and you get that quick cash injection, where you're going to get money into your bank account in a concentrated period of time, which allows you to make bigger, better decisions in your business, if you want to put some money back into the business. Or in your personal life, when things come up, you’re not just seeing money trickling into your business every, let's say, week, but you're seeing a bulk of money come in, which allows you to have more freedom.  

So, I see value in both. Live launching—the energy there. People want it now. They're ready to dive in. They want total immersion, and they're going to pay for it, and you're going to see higher conversions there, and you're going to see that quick cash injection. And then, in addition, to create a sustainable, scalable business, you've got money coming in every single day on the evergreen. I think both are essential, and you're doing yourself a disservice if you only think evergreen’s the way, because there's so much opportunity in live launching. 

Now, I’ll get off my soapbox because I feel very strongly about that. But I'd love to hear some of your strategies that you and your sister stay in the game during live launching, because there's no way to sugarcoat it. It is more stressful than evergreen. 

ANNIE: Yeah, of course. And I totally agree with what everything you said, 100 percent. Of course, there were times when we were thinking, “Okay. What if we just try evergreen for, like, a quarter?” And yeah, the fact is, you know, people need the momentum, and we ourselves as business owners. I personally really enjoy that momentum as well. But like you said, there would be times, it does take a lot of work, and you do need that time to reset and recharge.  

And so a lot of times, we do actually follow what you suggested in DCA, in terms of, you know, really giving ourselves the time leading up to the live launch, including—this is even before we have the prelaunch runway. Before the prelaunch runway even starts, we actually take some personal time off. I know it seems counterintuitive a little bit, but because prelaunch runway actually does give us enough time to regain the momentum that we need in order to get ready for that big launch. So even before the prelaunch runway, we take some personal time off and recharge and reset our mindset, and then start prelaunch runway.  

And I personally actually really enjoy that period right before the live launch, because—and this is kind of back to what we're saying about the live launch versus evergreen—I find that when it comes to running live launches, when I ask questions, ask our audience questions, ask our past customers questions, they actually are even—because they see the momentum coming, so they want to help more. So I get way better answers that I need to prepare myself for the live launch a lot more right before that live-launch period, the prelaunch-runway period.  

So that's also a really great way for us to connect with the community, and in terms of mindset, that really helps myself set my mind in the right direction. Instead of feeling drained, it’s more hopeful, if that makes sense, more empowering— 

AMY: Yes. 

ANNIE: —empowered by our community, as this is a two-way conversation leading up to the live launch. 

AMY: Absolutely. I love that. And one of the things that I always try to do, no matter—this was back in the day when I would have smaller launches, and even today when I have bigger launches—plan ahead of you taking a few days off after the launch.  

Now, because I love to be really realistic, sometimes that's hard to do because now you have a bunch of people that are in a maybe Facebook group and they're looking for you to be jumping in. But a lot of the times what I like to do is say, okay. I closed the cart on a Tuesday or Wednesday. And class officially starts, let's say, on a Monday. And so I give myself from Wednesday to Sunday to just decompress, maybe go on a staycation with my husband, sleep in, take naps, take walks. I just want to be refreshed before I start the course. But I also know I've deserved some time off. And I think if you don't plan that, it will absolutely not happen. So that's just a little tip for those who are live launching. Make sure you build in a little cushion afterwards to rest.  

Okay. So, I want to take this back a little bit. I was going to start here in this conversation, but I wanted to get to the really good stuff first. But I want to take a step back, because you actually went from offering a PDF product to a digital course to a membership and then evergreen, which you're my star student because I want to repeat that again. She went from offering a PDF product to a digital course then to a membership and then evergreen. So how quickly did you create a membership? And how did you know when was the right time to add it to your business? 

ANNIE: We started off this journey in 2018. So between 2018 and 2020, we continued to have PDF offers as our digital products while we started ramping up in terms of courses. And so in 2019, that's when we no longer would take one-on-one services, completely focusing on all of our digital products. So this is, like I said, PDFs and courses. And in 2020, that's when we, through you, we stumbled upon Stu, and then we started our membership offer and coupling that along with our courses, which we learned from DCA.  

And I specifically remember a conversation you had with Stu about, you know, how should you think about coupling membership and courses? And there's really not a right way, but it's what works for your business. So we were having a lot of brainstorming sessions internally, and, of course, asking the people inside our program, to see what they actually need and what they're looking for. So in 2021, that's when we—I want to say in 2020, we started experimenting with a membership idea. But in 2021 is when we finally finalized how that works alongside our courses. 

AMY: And how does it? Tell me how that works. 

ANNIE: Yeah. So, you know, in 2020 is when we first got the idea that, hey, while we're trying to figure out, you know, how to add even more momentum to our live launches, can membership offer be one of those add-ons for people who want more, who want more from us, who want more of that VIP support? And there is that upsell opportunity there by adding a membership as an incentive for them to join us and then join that VIP package, right?  

So then in 2021, that's when, okay, now we finalized, you know, how we're selling our courses, our programs, and how membership goes along with our existing courses. That’s the thing about evergreen launch, besides the live launches, right, because even though I love live launches, I do want to figure out a better way to make our live launches even better throughout the year. In order for us to do that, that means I need more rest in between. So this is why we wanted to add in that evergreen launch model.  

AMY: Absolutely. I mean, really, the truth of the matter in my own business is I only do one huge live launch a year, which is in September for Digital Course Academy. But if I do anything live launching throughout the rest of the year, it tends to be very small. And so I really want to be an advocate for a few-times-a-year live launching, but also have that evergreen component, so just like you said, so you can get the proper rest you need to show up in a big way when you're ready to do so. So I really love your business model. 

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So, tell me this: what is your most successful strategy to use when selling during your live launch? And then same for selling with evergreen and maybe the membership. Do you have different strategies that you're using, and if so, can you kind of break them down for us? 

ANNIE: Yeah, of course. So in terms of strategy, I would say the number one thing that really comes to mind is that something that we also took from DCA a little bit and then, basically, applied that across these, which is, really, co-creating all of our copies, our content, our bonuses with our audience. So we really focus on that research part of things. Even after we think that we’ve got our program to a good place, we continue to do that on an ongoing basis. We would even do that right before the live launch to see if there's any tweaks that we need to make in terms of how we are starting the webinar, for instance, how we are describing their headaches and challenges, right? And to see if there's any interesting things that they use, an interesting language they use, to describe these headaches and challenges.  

And now with the offers, we also are constantly surveying and asking them exactly what you need. And every time they tell us something that they need, we would put it in this idea dump. We, basically, have this document that we share with the entire team, where we just dump ideas from our audience. And every quarter, we will come back to this doc and really figure out, “Okay. How do we prioritize these ideas? Is this something that should be tabled to the next quarter, or is this something that we should be adding to our offers right now?” So I’d say that that strategy in itself has been really helpful in terms of making this a co-creation process, whether or not it's from marketing all the way to creating the actual offer and refining it. And that has been working really well across how we got to where we are today and even how we launch, how we package our things, how we are running our live launches, how we're running our evergreen challenges as well. A lot of these ideas actually come from our audience. 

AMY: So fantastic.  

Now, so, for your live launches, you do webinars, like similarly to what I teach in DCA, right? 

ANNIE: Yes. 

AMY: And then for evergreen, you do automated challenges with webinars? Is that right? 

ANNIE: Yes, correct. And the last webinar is, honestly, it is just a recorded version of a live webinar, the last one.  

AMY: Okay. For evergreen you’re talking about? 

ANNIE: Yes, for evergreen. So what we do with evergreen is that we do evergreen challenges, and these challenges are delivered. Initially, we actually experimented with the challenge in the way that we created a Facebook group. We showed up live. It actually wasn't evergreen. And then we want to continue to use the momentum for people to join us and feel great about the progress that they make at the end of day five, with a community of people we're doing this with them.  

But one thing that was really interesting to us was that we found that because of the people that we are marketing to and they are either solopreneurs or freelancers, their time is just so scarce that in order for them to show up and join the group and take the time out of their day for some of—for a lot of them, actually—it was difficult. So after, you know, rounds and rounds of brainstorming with them, we turn that into an evergreen challenge. But everything is delivered through emails, along with videos and instructions. But we have to make that instruction very, very easy to execute, but at the same time, get them progress, and also creating videos along with each email to make sure that they actually have everything that they need to execute the challenge. And then at the end of day five, then we add a call to action to watch that webinar, prerecorded live webinar, for them to understand more about our courses and program. 

AMY: Gotcha. Okay. This is fantastic.  

So, what is the element that helps keep the engagement up during an automated challenge? 

ANNIE: So that's when we realized that reminders emails and checking emails are really important, and with those emails, we actually make them, even though they're automated, we actually ask them an open-ended question at the end of those emails. So we actually have people on our team who can and who are assigned to responding to these emails. So they can be prompts like, you know, reply and send us your work, and, you know, let's see how we can help. Or we would ask, you know, okay, after all this work that you’ve done, what's the biggest question that you still have on the back of your mind about this topic? So we get a lot of engagement there, too. So in terms of the delivery of the challenge, it's evergreen, but in terms of the support, they can actually get more. And also, for us to further understand where are they stuck, in order for us to keep refining this challenge for them. 

AMY: Absolutely.  

Now, have you seen that these challenges have boosted your conversion rates? 

ANNIE: Yes, absolutely. And this actually was real interesting. I think out of all the people that went through a challenge, we actually have a pretty high conversion rate of 18 percent.  

AMY: Wow! So if they went through the automated challenge and bought, you're seeing 18 percent conversion versus, let's say, everyone who went through that evergreen funnel. If they didn't go through where, you know, they're going to take down the conversion. That's incredible. For evergreen, that is absolutely incredible.  

ANNIE: Yeah. And I think it's really just the difference, obviously, is because the people who actually showed up for themselves, completed the challenge, they got some sort of result, so they want more. And I think that’s a big difference. But of course, we're talking about—I also want to be real, right?—we're talking about out of all the people who signed up for the challenge, there's also only a subset of people who are able to complete the challenge. And we're probably talking about 20 to 25 percent max. And out of those people, 20 percent of them actually decide to join us, which yes, 18 percent is really high, and we love that about the challenge, which is why it's still, of course, part of our evergreen model. And we love coupling that with the momentum from live launches. 

AMY: Absolutely, absolutely. I love your transparency and your honesty around these numbers. It’s so valuable.  

So, I want to revisit this concept that you have two audiences. I know we've already talked about it, but I want to make sure—this is a big topic for my audience. So first, before I ask the question I really want to ask, let's get clear. Again, you have two audiences. Tell me one more time. Explain who these two audiences are. 

ANNIE: Yeah. So we have two audiences. One speaks English, and they’re mainly—they actually scattered, pretty much scattered in U.S., Canada, and also Malaysia, Singapore. And the other group of audience, they speak Mandarin, and they're mainly in Taiwan, Malaysia, and Singapore and Hong Kong. And so because of the cultural differences and because of how they're used to consuming these educational materials, over time, this is what we learned, that, you know, like I said earlier, one actually likes consuming something, or they want more hands-on support. They want all in one, right? Take me from the beginning to the end. Whereas, the other audience, they like the “a la carte” option, where I just want to buy what I need right now.  

And so we, basically, have one core, big offer, I would say, in the back end. But in terms of how we serve them, how we sell to them, we will break that down into, one is just give this whole offer plus membership plus personal support. The other one is break that down based on tactics, depending on what they're looking for. 

AMY: Okay. So is the U.S. and some of those Asian countries you mentioned, is that the one that's like, “Give me all the support. Give me everything”? 

ANNIE: Yes, yes. 

AMY: Got it. And then you have a subset of an Asian audience who would be more so, “Just give me the pieces I need right now.” 

ANNIE: Yes, correct. 

AMY: Got it. Okay. So I was not clear about that when we talked about it earlier. I'm so glad I asked again because I'm thinking, “I think I missed something.” This is even more valuable than I thought, because what I get asked a lot is someone will come to me, and let's say they are from Italy. They speak, obviously, fluent Italian, but they also speak English. And they're attracting a big U.S. audience as well. But they don't want to, then, abandon the audience that they've already attracted. And so they'll say, “Amy, should I have two different websites: one in English, one in Italian? Should I do two different webinars: one in English, one in Italian?” What do you do about that? 

ANNIE: Yeah. So that’s actually a really interesting question, and we had that same question, you know, a few years ago. And what we figured out is, quite frankly, yes, if I have all the time, all the resources in the world, if I were to launch this business from the start, with different audience speaking different language, of course, anyone and everyone would want to launch your entire website, entire program into language. However, what we learned is also keep in mind that they're not just speaking different language. The way they use social media and online tools are also very different, which is why we're able to not have a website in Mandarin up until this point. We do have a blog that mimics the English blog page in Mandarin, but we don't have a full website. Reason being a lot of them actually get things done—and I mean, our Mandarin-speaking audience—they get a lot of their information from Facebook page instead of going to websites.  

AMY: Interesting.  

ANNIE: Yeah. So I think it's really worth the time to dive deeper into how your audience is using and consuming these content, because a lot of things that you assume is a must, to them, not necessarily. But of course, with our Facebook page, it has to be more built out in Mandarin because that's how they see as a website. But what we remove are the headaches of setting up a whole new website, what about SEO, and all that stuff. So, yeah, that’s definitely something that we’ve learned. 

AMY: Fantastic. You know, the more you understand your audience and their behaviors, you make a great point, it might create less work for you based on what you discover. And so it's worth taking the time and listening and finding ways to make it work with both audiences.  

You're one of the very few students I have that has successfully been able to serve two different audiences in terms of location and the language they speak. And you've done it so beautifully and successfully. So, very exciting. And don't worry to my listeners, I’ll link to everything so you can check out how they do it.  

But before I let you go, we do this thing on the show, where I do rapid-fire questions. Are you good with me doing that with you right now? 

ANNIE: Yes, go for it. 

AMY: Okay. All right. So, first question is, who is someone that's inspiring you at the moment, and why? 

ANNIE: I’d say Brené Brown, because I just finished her book Gifts of Imperfection, and it's just right exactly where I need it. I just came back from my eight months’ maternity leave, thanks to DCA. 

AMY: Wait. Did you say eight months? Oh, that’s incredible! I know so many people on this podcast would die for that. Oh, my gosh. What an accomplishment. I know we're supposed to be in rapid-fire questions right now, but how did you pull that off? 

ANNIE: Well, it's because, you know, we were able to turn our courses and programs and turn that automated and being able to have the time to outsource some of the support that we need to outsource. And yeah, I think setting up an evergreen, couple that with live launches, was also the perfect model that was able to allow me to do that. 

AMY: Fantastic. Congratulations. 

Okay. So, I'll keep going. What's the best piece of advice you've ever received? 

ANNIE: Nothing happens if nothing happens. 

AMY: Yes. Get going. Take some action. Can you quickly share your morning routine and how that sets you up for a successful day? Do you have a morning routine? 

ANNIE: Yes, I do. And it recently changed since I now have my newborn. 

AMY: I bet. 

ANNIE: So, I'm super early bird, so I actually wake up at four.  

AMY: I knew it was going to be astronomically early. I was like, “So am I,” and then I thought, “Shut your mouth, Amy. I know she's going to say four.” 

ANNIE: Yes. So I start my day at four. So I jump right into work. I mean, I used to get all my workout done in the morning, but this is just more efficient. So I start my work from four all the way to when he wakes up, which is around seven. And so now I already get three hours of really high quality, this one most important work of the day done. 

AMY: So fantastic. I think that's incredible. I literally just came off of a podcast for somebody else, and we were talking about habits, and I said you create your habits based on the season of life you're in. And I think you've done a really great job. Three uninterrupted hours in the morning before you start your day has to feel incredible, so your mind's not always like, “I got to get to this. I got to get to this,” and you can be present with your sweet baby. So that's fantastic.  

ANNIE: Thank you.  

AMY: Okay. Two more questions. What does having a flexible business mean to you? 

ANNIE: It means being able to be present when I'm spending time with my family and my friends. 

AMY: Yes. I love that.  

And what are you most looking forward to this year? 

ANNIE: I'm really looking forward to stepping back to work, to be honest. I know it may sound cliche, but you know, after a good break, I really am excited for the new offers that we have coming. We're creating a new offer based on exactly what we learned from DCA, again. And this is something that we continue to go back to is what we learned in DCA, we can continue to use that again and again, every time we have a new offer and even with our existing offers. So I'm very, very looking forward to creating something new this year. My word of the year is create. 

AMY: Ooh, I love that. Yes. 

Well, I cannot thank you enough for joining us. And tell everybody where they can learn more about your business and what you do. Like, send them anywhere you want to send them. 

ANNIE: Yeah, of course. Feel free to visit our website, and that is oleaandfig. And also, TikTok or Instagram, and that's also Olea & Fig, O-L-E-A-A-N-D-F-I-G. 

AMY: Okay. Perfect. O-L-E-A and then ANDF-I-G. So that's where you’re going to find it. But I will link to everything in my show notes. I love that you said TikTok. We're going to link to your TikTok as well. 

And, Annie, thank you so much for being a star student and being so gracious to share all your insight. I really appreciate it. 

ANNIE: Of course. Thank you so much for having me. 

AMY: Okay. So before we wrap up, I've got to say really quickly, we talked a lot about DCA, which was not part of my plan, but I love any opportunity I can talk about how to take your knowledge and turn that into a digital course. If you want to get on the waitlist, go to amyporterfield.com/waitlist. That's where you go. Amyporterfield.com/waitlist. It will get you on the waitlist to Digital Course Academy so that in September, when I open the doors, and I only open the doors once a year, you will know that the magic is happening, that all the goodness is coming your way, and you can get all the details. So don't forget.  

All right. So a huge thank you to Annie and her sister Terrie. I love the way they set up their business, very similar to how I do mine. I love that they have evergreen and live launching. And just having this conversation with Annie makes me think I need to do more podcast episodes around how to manage the stress and overwhelm of a live launch while still doing them, because I think they're that important. I would never stop doing them. And actually, in the past I have, and I've seen a huge shift in revenue, so it does impact your revenue when you stop doing live launches. Some people might be okay with that, but I feel like I'd rather find ways to manage my stress around a live launch than stop doing them.  

I think I've got an episode coming up. I'm going to have to create it. But I mean, I think I just realized that needs to be an episode. And I also want to do an episode around live launching and evergreen and how to decide what to go into evergreen and how to move something into evergreen. And I think we need to have more conversations around that balance and that business model of live launching and evergreen. And Annie is a perfect example of someone who is doing just that. Taking eight months to be with her brand-new baby is very, very powerful. That probably changed her life. Like, not many women can say they got to do that. But her business model allowed her to.  

So, I think we need to dig into this further. DM me on Instagram. So on Instagram, I'm @amyporterfield. Simple as that. Send me a DM if you like this idea of me talking about live launching and evergreen even more, breaking down the nuances, talking about how to manage both, how to transition into both. Let me know via a DM on Instagram, and if I get enough feedback from all of you, you can bet I’ll be diving into those episodes. 

All right. So thank you so very much for tuning in. I cannot wait to talk to you again soon, same time, same place. Bye for now.