Transcript: Small-List Superhero: How to Have a Profitable Launch Without a Big List, with Tarzan Kay

June 27, 2019


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Well, hey, there. Welcome back to another episode of the Online Marketing Made Easy podcast. I’m your host, Amy Porterfield, and today, I’m hoping that my topic will give you a huge sigh of relief. Why? Because we're going to talk about how you can have an incredibly profitable launch without a big email list. Can I get an amen? I'm going to show you that it's not the size of your list; it's how you nurture and communicate with that list.

And to prove that this really can work, I'm bringing on someone who is a prime example of having huge success with launching with a very small list. Her name is Tarzan Kay. Tarzan is a launch strategist and email copywriting expert for online entrepreneurs and digital-course creators. Her specialty is fun-to-read, more-addictive-than-Game-of-Thrones copy for digital-course launches. You'll see she's even created a freebie for today's episode that has a Game-of-Thrones style to it that you're absolutely going to love.

Tarzan has worked with many seven-figure course creators, including myself. I absolutely love the work that Tarzan does. She has contributed to so much success inside of my business with her wicked copywriting skills, and she's also worked with one of my past guests and students, Kim Constable—she was on the show—and a whole bunch more. In her own business, she's actually used my webinar framework—shout out to my Digital Course Academy®️ members. You know with the webinar framework is—and she's used it over and over to sell her own courses, fill her private mastermind, and even had the occasional $100,000 month while working 30 hours per week and being the sole provider for a family of four. Honestly, I predict this is going to be one of the most downloaded episodes of the year because of the immense value you're going to learn here.

So, before we dig in, I want to give a shout out to Kia ro, who left this amazing review on iTunes. This is what she said:

“The bomb (but actually) this podcast has completely changed my life. I don’t know what rock I’ve been sleeping under for the past few years but found Amy’s material a couple months ago, and it has been an absolute game changer. I went from toying with the idea of an online course to not only finishing one but also having a clear plan on how to market and sell it. She’s the real deal. A perfect blend between information and inspiration. Stop reading reviews and just go listen. You can thank me later.”

Uh, Kia, you should be a copywriter. That is good stuff. Thank you so much for the shout out. It means more to me than you’ll ever know, and I am cheering you on every step of the way.

All right, I won't make you wait any longer. Let’s get to it.

Tarzan, welcome to the show.

Tarzan Kay: Oh my god. Am I excited to be here.

AMY: I’m so excited to have you here.

Now, I introduced you in the intro, so I thought maybe we would mix things up, and I have three questions for you that I think will give a really good insight into who you are and what you’re all about. Can I ask you these three questions that are completely not related to business?

TARZAN: I’m so excited. Go.

AMY: Okay, let’s do it. Number one, what are your children's names, and how’d you come up with their names, because they're both very unique, and I'm obsessed with your little ones.

TARZAN: Okay, so, the littlest one is Mo, and I don’t know. They were both cosmically delivered to us. So the little one’s Mo, and the older one is Gaian. And the older one—this was, like, one of those moments that gave me chills in my life. We were trying to think about a name for Gaian, and my husband, Jay, came up to me one time—actually, it was at the baby shower or something. I don’t know. We didn’t have a name for him. He came up to me and he was like, “I think I have the name.” But Jay will deliver things in a very strategic way. He’s like, “I think I have the name, but I don't want to tell you right now because I want to wait until the perfect moment.” And I was like, “Oh no, no, no, no, no. You just tell me right now.” He was like, “I think it's Gaian.” And I was like, “Oh my god.” I was so shocked because I love Gaia. I was like, “We should do something with Gaia. What would it be?” And then he came to me with Gaian, without even having that conversation. It was sheer magic. Anyway, Gaian and Mo. Those are my kids.

AMY: Okay, I love their names, and oh my gosh, is Mo still, like, the chubbiest baby in the whole world?

TARZAN: Ugh. I wish we could put him in the show notes, he’s so cute.

AMY: Oh, we will. We’re going to put both kids, if you’ll let me, both the kids in the show notes, and—

TARZAN: Most definitely.

AMY: —Mo and his big, chubby cheeks and chubby legs. I am a sucker for a chubby baby, so, yes. We’re going to show these cuties in the show notes.

TARZAN: And we got to fill in your listeners. I have brought my kids, both my kids, to your events two years in a row. And it is so much fun.

AMY: And power to the ladies. You were breastfeeding while I was there up on stage. Do you remember that?

TARZAN: That’s right, yes. Totally.

AMY: We’re getting it done, taking—what is that saying? Taking names—no, what is it?

TARZAN: Kicking ass and taking names.

AMY: Kicking ass and taking names, that’s what you were doing. So, love it.

TARZAN: That’s right. One time, I actually got on a meeting with you too, and I was like, “Excuse me. I have a new baby.” And you were like, “Oh, can I just take a picture and put this on my Instagram?” I was like, “Sure,” because I want more women to see this happening. I've brought my baby to group calls all the time. I'm a sole provider for a family of four. I can't just put my business away but nor can I just put my baby away. So they have to coexist.

AMY: And they do, and you do it very well. So, yeah, I hope we’re encouraging more women to do so.

Okay, so we got the baby names. Number two, tell me about your secret life of being fluent in French. Okay, so, first of all, I didn't know this until recently. What's going on here?

TARZAN: Okay, so, there’s a lot of Canadians that don't speak French, just FYI. Most of us don't. And then I moved to Quebec to study music and then law. And then in the middle of all that, I learned to speak French. As an adult, I took classes, like a gazillion classes, and I learned as a grownup. I’m pretty proud of that.

AMY: Okay, so, like, say something in French to us.

TARZAN: [speaks in French]

AMY: Okay, you actually say it like you really sound like you’re French. It’s kind of sexy, the accent you have there. Okay.

TARZAN: I just said, “Hey, what do you want me to say?”

AMY: Well, I wouldn't have known what you said, but it sounded really good.

Okay, so, third question. What is your all-time favorite line in a movie, and why?

TARZAN: Oh my gosh. My favorite line in a movie? What? Ames.

AMY: I wouldn't even able to answer this question, just for the record. I'm not really sure why I'm throwing it your way.

TARZAN: Okay, well, right now—and this is going to play into what we’re going to talk about later. So right now, “Dracarys.” That’s my new go-to phrase when I’m getting something done. “Dracarys.”

AMY: I love it. I love it.

TARZAN: And so, we’ll get back to that later.

AMY: Yes. And for the record, we're going to talk about Game of Thrones, and for the record, at the time of this recording, it is alive and well. We've got one more episode, so it's top of mind.

TARZAN: Ooh, I’m so stressed about it. Oh my god.

AMY: So stressed. So stressed, I hear you.

Okay, so now before we dive in, Tarzan and I have something extra fun for today. We have created a contest, and you will have a chance to win, and you're going to love this contest. Now, the prizes are either, number one, my totally rebranded, redone list-building course. It's called List-Builder’s Society. You will get access into List-Builder’s Society if you're one of the winners, or if you already have my list-building course, you can choose the Apple AirPods. So, we've got good prizes coming your way. We're going to talk about the contest at the end, so stay tuned. Good?

TARZAN: Awesome. Great prize.

AMY: Yeah. And the contest is so fun, and it's going to get you moving forward in the right direction with your list building and with selling, so just get ready.

Okay, so, Tarzan, we are talking about launching with a small email list. So before we get into all the details where you're going to share actual tips and strategies and techniques that you've used, before we get into all of that, I like to start with just wowing people, because I want them to really understand you are the girl that we need to learn from today. You have had the results. You've walked the talk. So with that, can you walk us through three successful launches that you've done with considerably smaller lists?

TARZAN: Yes. Great. Thanks for giving me a chance to brag. So, my smallest-ever list launch was to a list of 750 people. It was my first-ever time trying to sell any sort of course, and I was selling B-School. So, as you know, super-duper competitive. If you're going to enter that ring, you have to go all in. So I had a list of 750 people. And for the first time ever, I ran list-building ads. I had never done that before, but I knew it would be pretty important. So I doubled my list size before I even sent out any promo emails. So on that launch, I made $14,000, and plus—

AMY: Geez.

TARZAN: Yeah. I couldn't even believe it. I was over the moon. And I also won an award from Marie Forleo. She gives this Because You're Awesome Award to one of her first-time affiliates every year. So I won another $2,000, and I used that money to buy my first-ever car, which was—I feel a bit choked up just thinking about it. That was a really big deal for me. It was a major milestone. So, that was my first launch, 16,000.

Next time, this was a few launches down the road, but now I’ve grown my list to twenty-five hundred people, and now I’m introduced to Amy Porterfield and her amazing webinar framework. so that this time, twenty-five hundred people, I made $128,000, and this isn’t booked revenue; this is paid-in-full revenue. And I didn't even send promo emails, and I am the queen of promo emails. Like, I will promo email you until the end of time. But I didn’t. This was a quick launch that I was like, “I just want this to be easy. I'm going to launch this group program.” Twenty-five hundred people, $128,000. I couldn't even believe it. And I did that pitch exactly as you taught in Courses That Convert®️. That was last September.

So fast forward. Now I'm in the middle of a launch right now, and now I have Digital Course Academy®️. So I've used your entire new webinar framework. Now I'm launching to a list of five thousand. And when I emailed you yesterday about this, I was like, the cart's been open for twenty-four hours, and I've already made thirty-four and half thousand. Now, it's twenty-four hours later, and I'm up to nearly 80,000.

AMY: Oh my gosh. Forty-eight hours. Forty-eight hours, $80,000, five thousand people on your email list. Girl, oh my gosh. I am loving this.

Okay, so, obviously, you’re selling digital courses, right?

TARZAN: So, I’m selling digital courses and group coaching.

AMY; And group coaching. Awesome. Okay. So you guys heard, right? She started out, really successful launch with 750 people on her list. That's less than a thousand; I want to put that in perspective. And then twenty-five hundred, and then five thousand. And notice that Tarzan launched when she had less than a thousand people on her list. I often get asked, “Amy, how many people do I have to have on my list in order for a launch to be successful?” And we're here to talk about the fact that you can do this with the smallest, even less than 750. Let's just talk about the strategies and put this in perspective. So, if I were to ask you, Tarzan, how many people do you think should be on your list before you ever launch, what would you tell people?

TARZAN: Well, what I usually tell them is the number of people on your list is mostly a vanity metric. People love to talk about how big their list is. Like, “Oh, well, that's so awesome.” But I would have these clients coming to me and they'd be like, “Okay, I have ten thousand people on my list, and I'm trying to hit fifty thousand.” And my first reaction was, “Wow, I feel like a loser, because I don't have as many subscribers as my client.” And then I'd be like, “But wait. Why is my business three times more profitable, and I'm having all these successful launches?” And what I realized is the number doesn't mean anything. What is way more important is your relationship to the individuals on your email list. Let's not call them leads; let's just call them people. And your relationship to them is what will ultimately make your launch successful.

So I have seen people with lists of less than a hundred, but those hundred people are diehards that they have a really good relationship with, and their conversion rates, we can't even talk about them because they're ridiculously high. They're an absolute—in Fantasyville. But that's because they've built those really solid relationships. So I want us to stop thinking about, how many people do I have on my list? and start thinking about, how can I build relationships with individuals so that they know I'm real and I'm going to deliver for you?

AMY: Yes. I love this. Okay, so, along the same lines, a lot of people, like I said, feel as though they need to wait in order to launch. And you're saying, no, that is not the case. We need to stop thinking about these people as leads or subscribers, and remember that these are all people behind those names and emails. And so I'm curious: How did you get the courage to launch with such a small list? How did you even say, “Okay, I'm going to do this,” because it's a risk, definitely. That's a lot of work to put into it if it’s crickets.

TARZAN: Oh my gosh. It's so scary. And every time that I launch, I'm reminded how much courage it takes. When you're on the other side of it, you're like, “Oh, great. Launching’s so great. Look at all this sexy money that I made.” But on Tuesday this week, it was day one, and I was like, “Oh my god. I want to quit. I should just get a job.” Every time I launch, I feel that way. Yeah. That feeling comes up. It's a weird thing. So, oh my gosh, does it take courage. But the thing is, those who are successful launching, they launch, and then no matter what happens, they launch again and they launch again. The way you're going to learn and become successful at this is just by doing it.

So I would say I think people focus a lot on the revenue of their launch, and they think that's what it's all about. But there are so many things that come out of a launch, so many things other than just revenue. And I experienced that firsthand when I was promoting your program, Digital Course Academy®️, because there were so many incredible things other than revenue that came out of that launch, opportunities to speak on podcasts, relationships that I built. Some customers, they start to see the way that I market and build a relationship. They might not buy whatever I'm selling, but they might come back a month later or even a year later.

One of my students, she calls this the halo effect. She came to me and she was like, “I made this money with my launch, and, oh yeah, I also booked a speaking gig, and they're paying me $6,000.” I was like, “Oh, let's talk about that more.”

Launching isn't just about the people who pay you for your course. There's so many other benefits. You have no idea when you've just closed your cart all of the awesome things that are going to come out of launching. So don't wait. Just do it now.

AMY: So true. And I forgot that you had told me this, and I thought it was such a great angle that the relationships you made when you were launching Digital Course Academy®️ with other affiliates and people seeing you in different ways, when you put yourself out there, guys, you never know who's watching and who's listening. And you never know the different angle that someone might approach you based on you putting yourself out there. So you are so right. And one thing I love about you, Tarzan, as I mentioned in the intro, Tarzan and I have gotten to work together for years now. One thing I love about you is that it's almost like you don't take yourself too seriously. You don't seem to be a big worrier like I am.

TARZAN: Well, you know, your stuff is so beautiful, you're so conscientious about it, and we all admire that about you so much. I have a little bit rougher edges. And this happened to me a couple of days ago—I saved this email and told everyone about it—this guy emailed me and he was like, “I registered for your webinar, and then I added it to my calendar, but it was the wrong day,” and he gave me this long explanation of what happened. And he was like,” You know what, it's okay. Part of the reason I really like you is for your rough edges.” And I was like, oh my god, I wanted to hug him so much and put that on a billboard somewhere.

AMY: That is so cool because—okay, so, Tarzan, is a copywriter. The girl knows how to put herself out there and build this brand. But, Tarzan, someone saw you exactly how you feel. That's a big deal.

TARZAN: Mm-hmm, yeah. That’s a big deal. And that’s what I love about email is when my subscribers really see me, when I feel seen, and when they feel seen, that is when the relationship really blossoms and turns into something really special.

AMY: It’s so true. Now, you know my style. You know I like to get actionable here. And I was hoping that you would give us three specific ways that someone who’s listening right now could use their small list to their advantage.

TARZAN: Okay, great. So I want to refer back, though, to an episode. One of my favorite episodes that you've done this year was when you talked about some personal touches that you added to your launch. So your listeners, they got to go back and listen to that because those personal touches that you talked about, you can do that on steroids with a small list because there's fewer people to reach out to.

So a couple of ways—there's just—before I even answer this, I just want us to stop thinking about a small list as a disadvantage, because you can really use it so that it is your greatest strength. And I recommend adding all these personal touches. One thing that I do with my subscribers is I reach out with personal videos, and I do tons of them. To people who came to the webinar and they were really active in the chat, I'll make them a video on it, and I’ll say—

AMY: What?

TARZAN: Oh, yeah. For sure. I’ll make them a video, and I’ll say, “Hey, Ames. Thanks so much for showing up to my webinar. It means so much to me that you were there and so active in the chat. That makes the experience better for everyone. So I just want to thank you. And if you have any questions about my program, I’m here for you, and just hit reply and ask me a question.” Boom. That takes thirty seconds. And I use a tool called BombBomb. I’m a BombBomb evangelist. It’s all I can talk about. I’ve had it—

AMY: I’ve never heard of it.

TARZAN: Oh, it’s so good. I'm going to send you, Ames, so you can test it.

AMY: Okay, I want one. And I like name of it, BombBomb.

TARZAN: You're going to be totally blown away. So I used this tool when we were launching DCA, and I was like, oh my god, more people need to know about this. So I make these videos. It's like an extension for Gmail, so I can make the videos without leaving my browser.

AMY: Oh, stop.

TARZAN: Yeah. I know. You can knock off—I mean, my videos are about thirty seconds, and then it takes another thirty seconds to drop in the email and send it. So, honestly, you could knock out thirty in an hour, easily.

So I love—I love, love, love that tool, and my subscribers love it so much. I also have a whiteboard, so I'll put their name on it so they can see that it's actually personal. So that’s one thing that I do.

Also, replies. Replies to your emails, that's where the conversation is started. And ideally, this is great during a launch, but this is why you have to consistently email your list, because they will hit reply, and they will tell you what they want, they'll tell you what they like, and they'll tell you what they don't like. So if you're ever wondering, why do I have to email my list every week? or I don't know what to say, I always tell people, just email them and tell them something that's going to be useful, some lesson that you learned. Just be real with them. And they're going to respond to that, and that's going to start a conversation.

And this comes down to—this is what I mean when I say, think about them like they're people. They're not just subscribers. They're people who have the same hopes and dreams that you do. So just start that conversation.

AMY: Ah, so good. The personalization is so much easier when you do have the smaller list, the smaller community. And don’t get me wrong. Even though I have a big community now, I could still be making those one-off videos even if I just do it to twenty people on my webinar. But there’s something about grassroots when your audience is smaller because you can get to so many people that are on your list. So I love that you’re giving us these tips, for sure.

Now, based on your experience, what are some common email-marketing strategies that you’ve found don’t work very well with a small list, because this is kind of a flip side. We're talking about what works well, that personalization, for sure, but what doesn't work so well when we're talking about just email marketing?

TARZAN: So, most of the stuff that people are teaching, it does apply to a small list; it just doesn't work as well. Ultimately, what most of what we're learning is very highly scalable strategies, and you do have to know those. Those are really important. But if you are marketing to a list of two hundred people in your promotion, it's going to take you some time to write a promo sequence of twelve to fifteen emails. I think that time would be better spent just getting on calls with people that might be interested in your program. When you're small, you can do that. And people get scared to do sales calls, but it is a million times easier to sell on the phone than it is through email. So that's one thing you can do when you're small that other people can't do.

And, again, you can do things that are personalized. Instead of trying to make a promo email that's going to appeal to everyone, think about who on your list did you really create this for? How did you know they really need it? Send an email to that person and a couple other people like her. Did you have a great conversation with a client who reached out to you, maybe a potential client, and they didn’t book? Well, now you have an even more inexpensive solution, so why don't you reach out to him?

This is how you can really use your small list to your advantage. When you have a big list, you can't do that. So keep doing the scalable strategies. I still recommend writing those promo emails and sending them, but before even doing that, let's just get more face time with those individuals.

AMY: Yes. Okay, so, as I mentioned earlier, some of my listeners feel like they need to wait until their list is bigger before they launch. But when you were talking about the launch you did when you had 750 people on your email list, or when you made $128,000 without any promo emails to a list of twenty-five hundred people, what are some specific things you did in those launches that work? How the heck do you make $128,000 without sending promo emails, and how does a copywriter not send promo emails? What was going on there?

TARZAN: Yeah. I know. Thank you. When I said that, I was like, “and without promo emails,” which is my whole gig that I teach. But, so, that was not a low-price thing, and when clients come to me with a small list, and they’re like, “Oh, I just have a small audience, and I’m selling this $300 product,” I’ll be like, “Okay, what about selling something that’s $3,000? Could we just make the offer more exclusive?” So that launch where I made 128,000, the offer was $3,500, and there was an upsell which was $6,500.

And also, if you’re only welcoming—I had twenty people in that program, so at that stage, you can give them way more attention, you can give them a way more customized experience, you can actually deliver a lot of value and make it really worth thousands of dollars. It's not that difficult to do.

I do focus more on higher-ticket stuff. I do have a low-cost program for 297 that's running in the background, and it makes me money. It's okay. It's a list builder, and it sort of pays for itself, but it's not the most profitable thing in my business. So I sell higher-ticket stuff, and I get on the phone with people and make them a customized experience that they're not getting anywhere else.

AMY: Oh, so good. I love these tips. They’re so actionable and specific, and you know I live for that.

Okay, so, speaking of that, we’re going to get into even more actionable, specific tips that people can apply to their business, because sometimes people in my community feel like they’re emailing their list, but it’s crickets; nobody is paying attention. It makes them feel like no one's listening and all this work is for nothing. So you're a copywriter. Wordsmithing comes easier to you than most. But what advice would you give for someone that doesn't have a copywriting background but they want people to pay attention to those emails? They've got a list, now they want to do something with it.

TARZAN: Okay, so, I like to think about my subscribers as characters on Game of Thrones, and you can all apply this to your own emails. Actually, well, when we talk about a freebie, it’s all outlined there, so FYI. This is—

AMY: Okay, yeah, good point. So the freebie is part of the contest, and when you get the freebie—you can sign up to get the freebie, what Tarzan is going to take us through, and it’s so good. So pay attention here, but just know you’re going to get it outlined for you in a PDF. But walk us through this, because it’s so fun and valuable.

TARZAN: Okay. Yeah, I love this so much. So, my friend Sarah Greer, another copywriter, she taught me about how to think about people in these four different color codes, and there's lots of personality systems that are color coded, but I just changed them to Game of Thrones characters.

So I try to write emails for all of these four characters, okay? And some emails are going to appeal to all four, and some of them might appeal to just one. So let's take Daenerys, okay? She is a red. So the Reds are the really fast decision makers who only need to read five words before they know exactly what they want to do. So they don't like long emails. That's like “Dracarys! I already know what I want. You won’t bow to me? Dracarys!” So they're the ones that just like short and punchy emails that just get straight to the point. You might have an email that's literally five sentences long, and then there's a link. The Reds, they're going to really love that. These are the leaders, and they are the smallest percentage of people on your list, but they are the people who take action and buy your stuff, without a ton of nurturing. So you want to make sure you’re talking to those people. So that’s Daenerys. She’s a Red. Okay?

Moving on, Jon is the Blue. So the Blue, they’re emotionally driven. You know Jon, he’s so broody, and he just wants everyone to be happy, and he’s so loyal. So the Blues, they want powerful stories. They want to feel something. So for those people, I love to share pictures and stories. I like to acknowledge when something important has happened in the world. Anything that has hints of nostalgia or patriotism. Jon, he’s going to really love that. So for those people—for everybody, it’s a great idea to share stories. I try to make everything into a story, but particularly the Blues, they will love those stories when you can connect it to a really powerful emotion. So, that’s Jon. So we’ve got Daenerys, the Red—quick, clickable content. And Jon, the Blue—emotionally driven. Okay?

Next, we’ve got Tyrion. Tyrion is a Yellow, okay? The Yellows, they just want to have fun. They have a real sense of adventure. So you want to make it really interesting and entertaining. We all want to be entertained, right? Whenever you can make—I find my emails are super-duper entertaining, and because of that, my email subscribers are highly tolerant of me sending a lot of email. So I can send tons of promos. I can do back-to-back promos now and then, knowing that they're cool because they're entertained. But the Yellows in particular, think about Tyrion’s sense of adventure. Remember, he went all the way to the wall just to check it out? They love adventure. They love to have fun. They love to be with people. If you can make him laugh, cry, for those people, you can put in a funny gif. I use I just made one today. And I was doing a silly dance in front of my computer, and I turned that into a gif. So, they will love that. Any time you can be silly, I always try to add that element, a funny picture. So that’s Tyrion, the Yellow. Sense of fun, and he wants community, too.

Finally, we have Samwell, who is a Green. And by the way, Ames, you are a total Green. So, the Greens—

AMY: Oh, I love him.

TARZAN: Yeah. Hell, yeah. So you’re Samwell, great. He’s very kind. Samwell, he loves the details. If you think about him, he’s always reading and studying and using his mind to solve problems. So Samwell wants you to send him emails that are full of details, really useful tips and strategies, step-by-step things. These are the types of subscribers who will read every single word of your whole long-ass promotional email, and then they’ll read your whole sales page three times. And then, three months later, they’ll come back to you and be like, “But, Ames. You said this on your sales page, and where is that bonus?” That’s the Green. They’re super detail-oriented.

So, just to recap. We’ve got Samwell, the Green—loves the details, useful tips. Will read step-by-step things. Tyrion is the Yellow—loves fun. Use gifs. Make it a good time for him. Jon is Blue—make him cry. Daenerys is Red—don’t get in her way.

AMY: Okay, so, these are so good, but here’s my big question. We’ve got all of these on our lists, so how the heck are we catering to everybody?

TARZAN: All of your emails are not going to appeal to everyone. So you can make peace with that. There’s definitely a way to appeal to more than one person at once.

So the Reds, if you just have—in copywriting we use the term the TLDR—too long, didn't read. So you can put a TLDR at the bottom of your email, and just TLDR, program open; it's for so-and-so; enroll here. They're going to love that. So just add that in. They want it to be obvious what they're clicking on. Don't make link texts that's not clear. They're not going to like that.

And so for the for the Greens, who are super detail-oriented. In a launch, you're going to send some emails to them that the Reds are going to hate, because those are going to be long. You know Ry Schwartz. He loves to do the upgraded FAQ. Yeah, so that’s for the Greens. They want all those details. Some of these are going to conflict, but that’s okay. Everyone doesn’t read every single one of your emails. Things are going to stand out to them for a reason. And that’s why we send fourteen or fifteen promo emails.

Very few people, with the exception of some Greens—they’re reading every single one of them—but for the most part, they’re reading what catches their eye. So if you’re thinking about those people—let’s say you’re writing this upgraded FAQ for the Greens. But why not throw in a funny gif of you doing something silly? because the Yellows are going to like that, and it’s going to hold their attention. And just make sure that on that same email that there’s really clear link text so that you can skip all over that and just get to the sales page for the Reds.

On the sales page, by the way, on a sales page, it’s much easier to appeal to all of them because you can add all of these elements. You have more time. You can add a lot of story for Jon. You can put a button right at the top that says “I just want to enroll now” and skips down to the enroll button. That's for the Reds. All of your details, the whole sales page—the Greens, they're going to read it all. So you can add those elements for everyone on a sales page where you have more time. And sometimes you will be able to just knock it out of the park and write an email that appeals to all four of them. But I wouldn't worry about trying to hit all of those points on every single email. A lot of this is just you're forming the habit and thinking about different ways of giving people a lot of the same information, frankly, in a way that different types of people are actually going to digest it.

AMY: Okay, so this is really helpful. And I can see—sometimes I do those long emails that—you talked about Ry Schwartz—where I get into all the FAQs. And sometimes I’m like, “Hey, I’m I made you a quick video. Check it out here.” And I love what you said: not everybody on your list is going to read every email. And someone might see that super-short email, and that appeals to them, or the super-long email. Some are just not going to read it, and that's okay as well. So I think you just gave us all permission to try some of these different strategies. And you might see that every time you send a super-long email, it does really well, so you want to do more of those. And so pay attention, guys. Pay attention to the analytics, the open rates, the click-through rates, all of that, to see what's working really well.

TARZAN: Yeah, and also, just one more thing. Especially when you’re starting out, when you have a small list, your metrics aren’t as reliable, and it may look like they’re amazing because you only have a few hundred people on your list. So when your list is small, I always say the most important metric is how many people are replying and what’s the quality of those replies, because they will tell you what they like, and you will see, “Oh, this email, a lot of people replied to this, so they like this. I’m going to send more like that.”

AMY: Okay, that’s great. I would have never even thought about that, so I appreciate you pointing that out. Those replies are—they’re a big deal, and they make such a difference when you actually reply back. Even to this day, when I get in my DMs and I record on Instagram some audio messages, people love it because they’re like, “Ooh, you’re really paying attention?” Guys, it goes a long way, and it takes seconds. Right? So good.

TARZAN: Oh, yeah. Let’s just remind them, they have to listen to that episode, because it was so good, where you talked about personal touches on your launch. It was like February. Anyway, I’m sure you’ll link to it in the show notes.

AMY: Okay, I’ll link to it in the show notes. It was one of my favorites. I had just finished the Digital Course Academy®️ launch, and I said, “There's some personalization that we included in this launch, even though we have a big audience, and you can do it much easier with a smaller audience.” I'm glad you brought that up. We're going to link to it. It's a good addition to this episode, for sure.

Okay, so, we're going to tell you guys in a minute about this freebie and the contest that's attached to it. But before we get there, I know you love writing a good nurture sequence, and I'm not so good at this area, so I'm glad that we brought you on here because I want to talk about that, because the nurture sequence, for those that are totally brand new in this world of list building, it comes after a new subscriber has opted in to get your freebie. So let's say I've got a cheat sheet out there. You sign up for my cheat sheet. Now, what do those emails look like after? You don't have to send a nurture sequence, but it's always a really nice touch. So I was wondering if you could share with us some of your top tips on writing an engaging nurture sequence.

TARZAN: Great. So, at this time when people are brand new, that's when you really want to put a lot of energy into showing them your personality and who you are. So that's where I think it's extra important to use images and gifs, and introduce people to who you are. If you've been featured on podcasts, or maybe you have an article in Forbes or something, any credibility markers, it would be a great idea to add an email about those. Just remember, these people are new, and they don't know anything about you. So you got to come out swinging, or I guess a better expression would be, put your best foot forward. Show them what's incredible about you and why they should follow you. And this would be the place to really spend some time making sure these emails really reflect who you are and what your magic is.

I also think, ultimately—and I'm going to go against the grain a little bit here—but I love it when a nurture sequence is actually selling something, because we think, there's this idea that, oh, when people come into my email list, I have to nurture them and I have to send them all this free content before they buy anything from me. I think that is false. I think, actually if they come into your world and they buy something right away and they get good value from it, those are the people that are going to be your die-hard, buy-everything-you-make customers.

So my nurture sequence is, I have this quiz funnel, and it's a little bit fancy, but it can definitely be duplicated. So in this quiz funnel, depending on—I gather some information about my subscribers. I have one question that says, “Are you a service provider or a course creator?” And based on their answers, I send them different stuff.

So in a nurture sequence, if you can gather a bit of information about them—and it doesn't have to be fancy or involve a lot of automation. You may just have a freebie that's really specific to one type of person and another freebie that's specific to a different type of person. So when you're writing that nurture sequence, yes, it's about you and how amazing you are, but also, the more you can sort of pinpoint who they are and make it personal, like, I see you. I have this quiz, and so they may have told me that they are a service provider, and based on their quiz result, I know they're kind of struggling. So I'll write an email on what it was like for me when I was in that stage of business and what got me out of it. Of course, I always mention working with Amy Porterfield because that's a big credibility booster for me. So whatever you've done that people are going to start believing in you, make sure you add that in there.

And also, though, I think we get stuck with this because we think, “Well, I never climbed Kilimanjaro, so I don't have anything fancy to say about myself.” We have all done things, we've all done hard things, and it may not have been acknowledged by all the people in the world. But, I mean, we have all done things and been through—like going to Quebec and learning to speak French. Well, that's pretty interesting. That might be something that I could work into a sequence. I have in one of my nurture emails, there's a picture of me swimming in my pool, and it's a gif, and it's very silly. I'm just swimming in my bikini. But that's a story about me. It’s like, “Hey, look at me. I'm the sole provider for a family of four. I only work 30 hours a week, and I also go for swims in the afternoon when everyone else is working.” That’s equally interesting. You don't have to be working with Amy Porterfield for everyone to be impressed by you. There's other—

AMY: Certainly not.

TARZAN: Yeah, certainly not. Although, it definitely helps.

AMY: Girl, you’re such a love bug. I love you tons. She always makes me feel extra special. Tarzan always does, which I love that about you.

Okay, so, here’s the deal. We need to talk about this really fun contest. There are prizes. So first of all, you could win access to List-Builder’s Society. That's my brand-new list-building course. It's updated, rebranded, super exciting. Or if you already have my list-building course, or if you don’t want it, you could choose the Apple AirPods. So whichever one you want, we’re choosing two winners, and here’s the deal. Are you ready? Let’s do this.

Okay, so, you go to, and you download the freebie. This is a freebie that Tarzan created. It is really good. Now, it’s a value-packed, fun worksheet where she’ll teach you how to write a highly converting nurture sequence. You, then, need to create at least the first email in that sequence and send it to your list. Then, you take a screenshot of your computer screen, proving that the email was sent. You tag me on Instagram—I’m @amyporterfield—in your feed or story, and include the hashtag “EmailSent,” and you’ll be entered to win.

Here’s the deal. This contest ends in seven days from the day this episode goes live, which is June 27, 2019. We will randomly select two winners and announce the winners on July 5, 2019. All this info is in the show notes,

But here's the deal. This is what we want you to do. We want you to take action. You will learn how to create that nurture sequence from Tarzan's worksheet. You send out the first email. You show us you did it. You tag. You use the hashtag. You are entered to win. And it's really not about the contest; it's about you getting into motion, you taking action. And believe me, your list will respond to this. This is a really powerful strategy, so I hope you take us up on it. to grab the freebie, whether you want to enter the contest or not, and all the details about the contest are there as well.

Tarzan, this was one of my favorite episodes. I knew you would deliver. Thank you so, so, so, so much. And tell everybody where the heck can they find out more about you. They're going to want to. So where do they go?

TARZAN: Yeah, so, just come to website, And, yeah, there are cool freebies, but honestly, you should sign up just to be on my email list because I am the boss of email.

AMY: True. She really is. Like I mentioned in the intro, she’s been writing emails for me for a long time, and they're always so good. I'm always like, “Oh my god, that one was so good. I love it.” So if you want to see how it's done, you definitely want to get on Tarzan's email list.

Thanks again. I love you dearly. I love the work you do, and I'm so glad to have gotten this opportunity to chat with you.

TARZAN: Thanks, Amy.

AMY: Okay, so, there you have it. I hope you loved this episode with Tarzan as much as I have. The girl is on fire. She has so much to share. You've got to go check her out. And make sure you get the freebie because it's going to teach you how to create a nurture sequence that really connects with your audience. So if you already have a small email list and you want to make sure that that small email list actually converts for you, then we got to make sure that you are building relationship inside of that subscriber list. And this freebie is going to help you do so. So go to to get the freebie. And if you want to take it one step further, do the contest. It will get you into action, and you might just win. So

And before I jump off, one more thing. Next week's episode is really, really good. I'm going to show you how to create a lead magnet that will help you make money. There are so many different kinds of lead magnets, but one of my favorites is a profit-driven lead magnet, a lead magnet that also takes into mind your profit path, how you're going to move that new subscriber into a paying customer. So I'm going to give you the three key questions that you must ask yourself in order to create a profit-driven lead magnet. And also, we're going to walk through some examples of what works and what doesn't work in terms of a lead magnet that will make you money. That's next week's episode, number 270. Do not miss it. In the meantime, go download that freebie. And I will see you same place, same time, next week. Bye for now.

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